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What I expect from Next Krita, Big Bugs in Airbrush Dynamics

User avatar Aman Shah
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Good news is,new Windows Version of Krita,Krita 3.0 is to be released soon,which would be very well optimised.
What I expect from Krita 3.0:
1) Improved Lasso tool with more precision.
2) Improved Brush responsiveness.
When I move airbrush brush slowly to apply special shading effects /Light effects as patches in car designs in Krita 2.5.9,I find sudden Intermediate change in brush size or intensity.(Tried on a laptop on a trial basis,buying a new high end 13.3 inch Tablet PC with stylus)

The change in intensity or size is like a sudden large point in a stroke.It actually occurs at points where your stylus input was intermediately slow.

For example,above the wheel arches when I apply airbrush on selected area with lasso tool,with a semicircular path,slowly,the airbrush intensity is not exactly uniform.I think the pressure increases if you move slowly and its not Optimised well in Krita 2.5.9.

You should not apply airbrush fastly at everyplace over wheel arches,otherwise the effect would not be proper.

Pressure sensitivity should be active only where its needed,not everywhere.

This bug needs to be fixed in Krita 3.0.

Suggestions in Air brush Dynamics:
1)Increase in pressure and increase in size at a particular point only should not be a function of time.
2)Brush size at a particular point should not increase if the stylus is moved very slowly.
3)There should be one input at one point/location at a time only.
4) Increase in pressure and size should be a function of both time and incremental Position,in combination Only,Not Seperately.
(I am not a software enegiering expert and hence I may not be able to properly convey what I want to convey here.)

Last edited by Aman Shah on Fri Dec 21, 2012 6:36 pm, edited 8 times in total.
User avatar Animtim
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This ain't no bug ;)

There are 3 dynamics parameters activated on the airbrush presets:
-Opacity depends on pressure (with a sort of exponential custom curve)
-Size depends on pressure (with a sort of logarithmic custom curve)
-The airbrush parameter is "on", meaning it keeps "spraying" colors even if you don't move, with the rate depending on the airbrush parameter value.

Any of these 3 dynamics can be tweaked or desactivated (and then overwrite the preset,or save another one) through the brush settings panel (on the top bar, at the right side of the background/foreground color)


User avatar Deevad
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Aman Shah wrote:from Krita 3.0


actual version = 2.6 (soon) in 2013
2 release / years = + 0.2 version each year
2.6 + ( 2 * 0.2 ) = 3.0
3.0 = 2015

I think by 2015, you'll see improvement o)


User avatar Aman Shah
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Sorry for confussion.I think,it's 2.6 as heard by me. :)

Last edited by Aman Shah on Wed Dec 19, 2012 11:13 am, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar Aman Shah
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Animtim wrote:This ain't no bug ;)

There are 3 dynamics parameters activated on the airbrush presets:
-Opacity depends on pressure (with a sort of exponential custom curve)
-Size depends on pressure (with a sort of logarithmic custom curve)
-The airbrush parameter is "on", meaning it keeps "spraying" colors even if you don't move, with the rate depending on the airbrush parameter value.

Any of these 3 dynamics can be tweaked or desactivated (and then overwrite the preset,or save another one) through the brush settings panel (on the top bar, at the right side of the background/foreground color)


Thanks dude,but if anybody has additional info or wants to discuss about Brush responsiveness problems,please go ahead here!

In Krita,how to adjust pressure sensitivity,can anybody suggest a nice tutorial on this.A video tutorial would be best.

Once again please consider these Airbrush parameters needed to be focuses on in next versions of Krita:

1)Increase in pressure and increase in size at a particular point only should not be a function of time.
2)Brush size at a particular point should not increase if the stylus is moved very slowly.
3)There should be one input at one point/location at a time only.
4) Increase in pressure and size should be a function of both time and incremental Position,in combination Only,Not Seperately.

When I move airbrush brush slowly to apply special shading effects /Light effects as patches in car designs in Krita 2.5.9,I find sudden Intermediate change in brush size or intensity.This issue needs to be taken care off in Next versions of Krita.

Last edited by Aman Shah on Fri Dec 21, 2012 6:37 pm, edited 3 times in total.
User avatar Deevad
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Hi, I did a video about a brush creation : http://youtu.be/wnol3izUXvA
There is all setting already existing for you to create a preset suiting your needs in Krita.
You need to learn
1. how to do a preset ( on the video you can see how I save a new one )
2. For pressure, editing the pressure curve and experimenting ( idem, you see in the video )
3. Size depend of pressure ( idem, you see in the video )
4. " if the stylus is moved very slowly" , for performing this , you need to tweak the 'speed' sensor.

For more tutorials on Krita in general , I advice this link : http://userbase.kde.org/Krita/Tutorial_1/en


User avatar Aman Shah
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Thanks,Deevad,for sharing some useful info!
However,I don't think I have seen the peculiar problem I was talking about,"....if the stylus is moved very slowly......",in some of the Softwares like Art Rage,PD Howler,etc.I had used trial versions.Yes,some softwares have this problem including Krita 2.5.9.
This issue should be discussed by Krita developers.
valerievk
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Um, although I don't have a tablet so all my tutorials are for mouse-users, I do explain the different settings in my tutorial on pixel brushes here:
http://white-heron.deviantart.com/#/d5k5y49
http://white-heron.deviantart.com/#/d5k5yj4

I'm not completely sure what the issue is, but it sounds to me like it's an issue with uniform shading and smoothness. I think there are actually several settings involved here:
1. Opacity + Opacity dynamics
2. Flow
3. Brush spacing
4. Brush fade
5. I'm not sure if Airbrush mode is the issue here.

With lower Flow, lower Brush Spacing and/or lower Brush Fade, the brush won't be "uniform." There are several ways to fiddle with this, but since I'm not completely sure what the issue is, I can't tell for sure. Could you either provide a screenshot or look at the relevant parts in my tutorial, and try to point out where the issue is exactly?
User avatar Aman Shah
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Hi,
good morning,thanks for useful links,I would definately see them.I would try to provide some example screenshots of strokes in krita on my dad's laptop using camera(Do not have screen capture software with me).
I would see these links on my laptop this afternoon after returning from college,IPad 2 doesnot support "flash" or some other formats.
However,I think you have understood the problem.
valerievk
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Oh, in that case, there's also a Wiki version:
http://userbase.kde.org/Krita/Tutorial_4A
http://userbase.kde.org/Krita/Tutorial_4B

I don't use an iPad though, so I don't know if wikis work on iPads either. Anyway, the way the Opacity, Flow and Airbrush settings interact isn't necessarily what you'd expect, but as I said, I don't use a tablet, so there may be tablet-related problems that I'm not aware of, so screenshots should help. :)
User avatar Aman Shah
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Thanks a lot,I am now seeing through whole tutorial over my Wndows Vista Laptop.The tutorial contains lots of awesome information about Brush dynamics in Krita.My dad's laptop runs on Windows 7 on which I am trying Krita and other softwares at night,so that I get right sketching softwares after I get delivery of Fujitsu Lifebook T902 tablet PC,running on Windows 8.
My windows Vista Laptop won't support Krita 2.5.9.There are so many softwares on Market.
Perhaps,Krita and GIMP are the best of whole bunch.Other softwares I liked a little bit is PD Howler Astist.
There are many parameters which I testing on several trial versions of several Softwares.
Now I will go through the tutorial you have suggested. :)

aware of, so screenshots should help. :)

Definately,I should use krita on my dad's laptop,at evening and should take shots using camera ,this should illustrate the problem!

Last edited by Aman Shah on Thu Dec 20, 2012 10:35 am, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar Aman Shah
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Referring to http://userbase.kde.org/File:Krita-tuto ... .1.a-1.png
"randomness" here refers to what?

I think these two sections might be of interest to me:

"Time: holding the mouse over the area will drop additional copies of the brush, basically increasing opacity (1)
Flow: the higher the flow, the faster the airbrush works.
Rate: the lower the rate, the faster the airbrush works, so don't reduce it and wonder why it's working too "fast"
Opacity: no matter how long you hold down the airbrush, the maximum opacity value you can get is the opacity you've defined. (2)
It will basically gradually bring all areas of the brush with lesser opacity to the maximum value. A "form-filler", in some ways. (3)
Wait a moment, that sounds kind of pointless! Not really, the form filling takes time. In the meantime:

You can basically control the opacity of your brush simply by holding over an area longer.
If you are using soft round brushes, you can produce the illusion of brushes of different sizes and hardness. This saves you the trouble of manually adjusting the opacity each time.
"
AND

"
The Opacity setting simply sets the maximum opacity a single brush stroke can leave:

No matter how many time you can pass over the same area many times with a single stroke, it will not go over that value.
A non-uniform brush will leave areas less opaque than others, though passing over that area enough times will bring it to the maximum opacity value.
This also sets the maximum opacity when using flow and airbrush mode: they will only build up to that opacity level.
"

But I do not hold the mouse at same place for long time,I actually move mouse quiet a bit slowly (With intermediate pausing for a Microsecond ,at allmost top of wheel arch of side profile of car design,),at complicated curves like Wheel arches to give special shading effects.Here also I am getting Non-Uniform strokes with few points of high intensity,like a hotspot on a semicircular stroke,over wheel Aches.

As I mentioned previously,I should not apply fast strokes at delicate places where poper shading is necessary.I give such special effects over a new layer on a selected are by using Lasso tool.


I would try these things!

:) ;) May be I need to decrease "Flow". :) :)
valerievk
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Increasing randomness and decreasing Density work about the same: you get lots of small dots instead of a large one. Err... there are examples in the brush tip section. Here:
http://userbase.kde.org/images.userbase ... .1.a-2.png

Anyway, I'm not really familiar with your technique (in particular, I don't know how "sharp" you want the edge to be). Decreasing flow will actually make the output Less uniform though, see:
http://userbase.kde.org/Krita/Tutorial_ ... behaviours

If you want slower airbrush, Increase the Airbrush rate instead. To have a nearly completely uniform shading with perhaps a blurry edge, the best way is to draw the shape as a selection and feather the selection before coloring it. I'm not sure if this is the effect you want though, so alternatively, lower the opacity and turn off airbrush mode. I actually don't use airbrush mode much, it's a bit hard to control.

If you use selections a lot by the way, you may want to check out local selections. I describe this and other layer features here:
http://userbase.kde.org/Krita/Tutorial_2
User avatar Aman Shah
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Well Thanks a lot.I realised that I should read the helpful Krita user guides carefully thoroughly ,and then try all possible changes on Krita.I am running windows version of Krita presently on my Dad's laptop(Version 2.5.9).

While using airbrush I don't want edges to be very hard.because what I like to do is use flood fill on parts of a car profile and then select areas with lasso tool and then use whitish or slightly light greyish Arbrush or soft eraser to give the needed Light or shading effects.This is a common practise with most professional car designers.
Wile this can be done in Sketchbook Pro(I believe,can be done on also Corel Painter),it has limitations of Image size,making it unsuitable for detailed car designs with all profiles(Side,back and front) on one page,with Taillamp,side lamp and side indicator details.I doubt that this also can be done in Photoshop but Photoshop has really very bad Image Quality when it comes to large size Images.
You cannot easily do seperate details car profiles on seperate pages.Its really difficult to do that.

Last edited by Aman Shah on Thu Dec 20, 2012 11:35 am, edited 2 times in total.
valerievk
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In that case, the Softest brush is Gaussian brush with Fade value set to 0. :) I don't design cars, so I wouldn't know, sorry.
Anyway, yes, Krita's various settings can get pretty complicated, so try tweaking values and see how they go. :)

 
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