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Feature Suggestion:Collabrative Sketching of ideas.

User avatar Aman Shah
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Hi everyone,
I don't know how many of you will like my idea since most use Krita for Cartoons,Comics and Illistrations,etc.
But my idea if can be implemented can revolutionarie the use of a sketching software in car designing Industry where the large canvas size which is desired for designing all profiles of the car(Side/Isometric/Front/Back) can be replaced with 3 or 4 less powerful computers on which only one profile for each PC can be designed collabratively,in synergy.

For example,if I use a particular contrast colour on a car design profile on one computer,the server will save that colour in a library and that colour can be used for another profile on different computer.

Advantages:
1)Near Perfect dimensions of different profiles of a same car being designed can be drawn in Synergy/Synchronisation simultaneously(Not seperately).
If I use different canvasses for different profile views(Side,front,rear,Isometric),then for example:a side front window of the car design may appear larger in side view profile than that what appears in an isometric view profile,and this is never accepted as a "Product design".This problem, can be reduced a lot by Collbrative Sketching of ideas.
2) No variation in Colors,shading properties,etc.
3)different computers for one profile consume less independent memory and Processor speed is high due to less load on Individual Tablet PC.
4)Less stucking or auto shutdown since image file size per independent computer is very small.
5)More and more Software developers would incorporate this feature since more and more car designers in a professional real car designing industry would shift towards Krita from typical product design Softwares like Sketchbook Pro.
(Most car designers use sketchbook pro.I have seen some using GIMP,nowadays.)


If this feature is already existing,please let car designers seeing this thread know about this.

Now that its too late to incorporate this in 2.6 or 2.7,why not try incorporating this in 2.8?

Last edited by Aman Shah on Mon Feb 11, 2013 8:57 am, edited 6 times in total.
User avatar Aman Shah
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Or else...

There is an another option which can be implemented and which will be more easier to implement,but at same time,will produce similar advantages as suggested by me in above post :-


This option is displaying four seperate canvas files isolated by two perpendicular lines on same screen on same computer such that zooming of a one file (one canvas)on which one of the car profile is drawn will also increase/decrease size of other canvas files,such that maximum or full screen area will be occupied by the canvas file which is primarily zoomed.

This will be analogous or similar to zooming only one profile drawn on a big canvas containing sketches of all car profile views , the only difference being that in reality,all profiles will be seperated and displayed on different files on a single screen.

This should be best and better option than earlier one.This would be indeed very very helpful for me.

Last edited by Aman Shah on Mon Feb 04, 2013 6:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar nezumi
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I dare to say you're probably only person interested in such features. And again you are writing another post instead of just editing previous one...

Look, I get it. You're young, passionate about car designing. Cool. But please, finally STOP creating all those POINTLESS threads that clearly nobody is interested in (did you noticed lack of answers?..). Youre spamming this forum. Not only you create similar threads - you post in each of them couple posts of your own, without anybody engaging conversation. Answering to yourself, brainstorming, talking obsessively about car designing while people show very little (if ANY) interest. Just get over it man - devs will not jump on coding something that one person is interested in. Get real, Krita is not "car designing software" and except you I dont see anybody who wants to go this way.
Plus, I dont know much about car designing but I seriously doubt that they are sketching ideas on nearly... ten meters long canvas. They just sketch those things. Nobody makes 1:1, detailed representation of a car - unless you mean "tape drawing" which is clearly not something Krita is made for. But even then people are often working on a 1/4 scale tape drawing. That would be 7000px on a longer edge and you can make it in Krita. If that size is good enough for Renault designers then it should be for you as well... *sigh*

If for some reason you need monstrous canvas then go for MyPaint which has UNLIMITED (limited by your computers memory) canvas. But before you start to draw cars is 1:1 scale PLEASE stop spamming. Please. You can see how little interest is here for car designing? Give it a break.
User avatar Aman Shah
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Hmmmmmmmmmm!!!
Never expected a comment like this!
Practically,all other suggestions I requested in other threads are not much very specific for car designing applications only.
For example:A illustration artist may have the same selection tool problem which may resolved in next versions of Krita.

The suggestion in this thread is the only suggestion as of now,only usable for car designing/product designing type applications.

And yes,I am not spamming.
One should understand that sketchbook pro and Krita are designed for same variety of applications,the only difference being that the image size which sketchbook supports is much much smaller than that in Krita and also that the Krita is not well marketed in car designing industry.You could do comics in sketchbook pro also.

A car designing sketching software is not at all different from a comic or cartoon or illustration software like Krita.
You are telling as if Krita is only for comic artists and car designers are not allowed to use Krita.
This is not correct!
No instruction is officially given that car designers would not be allowed to use Krita and would not be able to demand any features.
The layout used for designing cars as of now in Car industry is the same used by comic/Cartoon artist or illustrators,painters,etc.

I would like the same suggestion to be made for Sketchbook Pro software to Autodesk.
User avatar boudewijn
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Sorry Aman,

But I have to sort of agree with Nezumi. Over the past weeks I've seen you pop up every place where Krita is mentioned, repeating the same things. I am beginning to sort of feel stalked, actually. Please -- Krita is not meant for "designing cars", whatever that is. I'm pretty sure people who do that for a living have their own tools already, and I'm also pretty sure they don't need an enormous canvas, probably because they use proper cad tools.

Krita is for making illustrations, comics, concept art, textures and for 2D painting tasks in a VFX/movie workflow. That's it -- and given that we're only a few people working on it, we're not going to add another target user group.
User avatar Aman Shah
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I'm pretty sure people who do that for a living have their own tools already, and I'm also pretty sure they don't need an enormous canvas, probably because they use proper cad tools.


Your assumption is not at all very correct:
The product design Process consists of
1) Concept Design (Needs softwares like Sketchbook Pro(Commercial),Corel Painter(Commercial) or GIMP(Freeware) or Krita (Freeware).)
2) Surface modelling (examples of softwares used:Sketchbook Designer)
4) CAD model with exact dimensions and exact material specifications (examples of software are Solid edge,Autodesk Inventor,Autodesk AutoCAD Mechanical,AutoCAD electrical,etc)
5)Enginiering analysis and Optimisation. (Examples of softwares:Ansys,Pro-E,Espirit,etc)
6) Design review
7) Final 3D documentation.

A new car design starts from 2 D sketches from Krita,Sketchbook Pro or Corel Painter.
It's not true that everything car designers want is available.
Car designers find too difficult to design different car profiles seperately on seperate canvasses.
They do need large canvas size which Krita supports but not Sketchbook pro.

CAD tools are used only after a concept design is made.
Generally no one directly does car designs on a CAD software.

There is a very big similarity between a normal product design process and a car design process.

Last edited by Aman Shah on Mon Feb 04, 2013 1:16 pm, edited 7 times in total.
User avatar Aman Shah
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Dear Bludewijn,
I do understand and appreciate your words and humble effort to make Krita a very good software package.
At the same time,I think,Krita is already allmost ready for car design applications,much better than other softwares.

For example,in next few versions,I expect
1) less bugs like less auto shutdown errors even for a large canvas size.
2) Better selctions tools which developers are working on(Needed in not only car industry but also for comics and illustrations).
3) Better texture brush engines,needed not only by car/product designers,but also by comic artist and illustrators,

So practically the feature suggestion I talked about in this thread is the only thing specified only for car designers or product designers.
I don't think,Car designers do need anything additional special tools in Krita other than this possible feature I suggested.
In other words,Car designers mostly use the same tools available in any sketching/illustration softwares.

Because,Krita is not targeted at car designers/product designers,hence I didn't mentioned as "Feature Request",but a "Feature suggestion".
It doesnot matter if my this suggestion is not accepted.We can still use Krita for car designing,if all of the above mentioned expected features can be seen in Krita's next versions.
User avatar nezumi
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Aman Shah - let me try again.

- NO ONE here cares about car designing. If you have suggestion how to improve Krita you're free to post it BUT FOR THE LOVE OF GOD, DO IT O-N-C-E and leave it for devs to consider. STOP SPAMMING.
- If you want to add something, and there is no answer just edit previous post instead of creating new one. Youre bumping those threads without reason.
- If you want to help Krita then SIMPLY USE IT AND REPORT BUGS. One valid bug report is worth more then 100 posts about "it would be great if...".
- Youre not a boss of developers - using phrases as "I expect from next version" sounds rude. They are the ones that are doing us all a favor - RESPECT THEM. If your English is falling short here and there it is understandable. Try to use "I would like to see in next version" instead of that "I expect".
- NO ONE here is interested in car designing.

Did I mentioned already that NO ONE IS INTERESTED IN CAR DESIGNING? Well, lets be clear about it - NO ONE IS INTERESTED ABOUT CAR DESIGNING. Therefore - if you want once again describe process of car designing (for tenth time...) you have to know THERE IS NO AUDIENCE FOR IT.
User avatar Aman Shah
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A bug is something related to problem in coding and performance.I had listed the problem of lasso tool as a bug on the bug listing website of KDE.
Any feature request or suggestion is not a bug.
Therefore,I wish,Krita team should have seperate section for making suggestions or feature requests.

- Youre not a boss of developers - using phrases as "I expect from next version" sounds rude. They are the ones that are doing us all a favor - RESPECT THEM. If your English is falling short here and there it is understandable. Try to use "I would like to see in next version" instead of that "I expect".

I do respect them.
it is just about the expected stuff/improvements based on the discussion taking place on this website as well on several blogs outside this forum about developments occuring in improvements in Krita's next versions.(For example:Slangkamp claimed that he has increased the precision in lasso tool for future versions and so I expect or in other words see a good chance of realising it in next versions of Krita.)

Its not what I expect developers to compulsory do.
The Indian way of conveying things is different than European way.Its like difference in body language.Its not a fault in Grammer.
User avatar nezumi
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Aman Shah wrote:A bug is something related to problem in coding and performance.

Exactly - and if you would like to help in developing Krita reporting bugs is the best you can do if you are not coding yourself.
Aman Shah wrote:Any feature request or suggestion is not a bug.

Obviously. You dont have to suggest the same thing over and over again. Say it ONCE and if people are interested it will start discussion. If are not, then just accept lack of interest and stop spam. No matter how many times you write post it will not make us get into car designing.
Aman Shah wrote:Therefore,,I wish,Krita team should have seperate section for making suggestions or feature requess.

You will probably start spamming there exactly the same things that you already said here, so lets just leave it... Sorry but I am being honest.
Its just expected things based on the discussion going on various improvements in next versions of Krita

Normally discussion takes place when more then one person is involved in it. If you alone are talking again and again about same things that have ZERO interest from other users then it is called "monologue" and if you really have to do it - make ONE THREAD and keep it there instead of overwhelm whole forum with multiple posts of almost the same substance.
Aman Shah wrote:The Indian way of conveying things is different than European way.

Old proverb says "When in Rome do as the Romans do".
Aman Shah wrote:Its not a fault in Grammer

grammar ;)

OK buddy - I got things to do. EOT for me. If you didnt get it to this point you will not get it. And if you did then thanks for your cooperation.
Silvio Grosso
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Hello Aman,

I am sure you didn't mean any harm (really!) by requesting over and over again the "same" features ;)
I am also aware you judge your suggestions as being very important for your future work as a car designer.

However, in every open source software the developers are generally only a few and they are usually quite busy (mostly with their personal life and their real work).
Naturally, as you know, they work on Krita only in their very limited amount of time.

As a consequence, once you have made yourself clear (which believe me, you DID) about your wishes and suggestions you only need to be patient and just wait.
Since you look quite young, I am aware it is NOT that simple for you ;)

At present, you have plenty of other open source softwares to try (Gimp, Inkscape, LibreCad, Blender, MyPaint) on top of Krita.
I am 100% sure all of them might be of some use for your needs.
Therefore, please, try not to be "obsessed" (no offence here) by having all your suggestions implemented and available in Krita :)

Usually, to get a very powerful software (in terms of features) you need MANY full time developers (highly paid to work on it).
Most of all, you usually need MANY years to stabilize it :(
Photoshop, for instance, is much more than 20 years old [1].
The same applies to AutoCAD [2] and to many other softwares as well.

By the way, about the bug concerning the Lazo fixed by Sven, from what I have gathered, you need to wait for the 2.7 version of Krita....
Unfortunately, this next stable version is likely to be many months away to be released...
In essence, it looks like this fixing will not be available in the upcoming 2.6 version.
Then again, you just need to be patient (there is NO point about moaning over and over about this)...
Actually, you might already try the 2.7 version on Linux (by compiling yourself the unstable 2.7 source on Linux).
However, unless you have already some BIG experience on this different platform, I do NOT suggest you to follow this option.
In short, because it is NOT that easy to apply (very far from it) since compiling softwares in the Linux Shell is usually quite difficult for beginners.

Best regards,

Silvio Grosso

[1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Photoshop
[2] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AutoCAD
User avatar Aman Shah
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Thanks a lot,Silvio,

Photoshop is fast,has everything else you need but.......
There is one problem in photoshop which is related to blurriness of the screen for large size canvas. (13.3 inch to 14.2 inch).
One thing that keeps it away is the blurriness of the screen.
I have tried so many painting/sketching softwares,and found that photoshop is fastest,has large image handling capacity.GIMP is second fastest.
But the very high blurriness of the screen in photoshop for large size canvas is irritating and uncomfortable to eyes for car designing.

I want to take up this issue with the adobe team.Its an issue with display quality,not the file quality.You don't have the same problem with GIMP.

If adobe team can solve this issue,there is no problem for my dad to buy me student version of Adobe design and web premium edition of creative suite.Yes it's still costly,but does not matter,not as costly as TV Paint software.
User avatar Aman Shah
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Hi,
Everyone.
Today I will share something,many product designers and Car designers like me always as dreamt of.

Usually,people used to sketch car designs on Krita,Photoshop,TV Paint Animation and OpenCanvas,etc. and then the car design sketches would then go to 3D CAD department.
However,the most headache for car designers was canvas size limitation due to which when all car design profiles are drawn,the detailed headlamp/signal lamps ,etc designs were not possible to be created in most softwares.
Any Product design starts from an idea/Concept and I am glad that dassault systemes is the first company in the World to actually understand Product designer's problems and launch a correct Natural Sketching feature in the latest CATIA V6.
This is going to be a very big revolution.

A shuttle change in he automotive and Product design Industry.

To help car designers,CATIA V6 is been launched with 3D Natural sketching.
Wow! 3D sketching,I am sure many of you Never heard of it.

I can't ask Boudwejn to make Krita a 3D sketch software,since its beyond the scope of Krita.However this is amazing and a big breakthrough.
Various student 3D Sketching software projects include

ILoveSketching

Moderato

Rhonda

JustDrawIT
,etc.

Only Rhonda is available for free download which is too primitive to be used by Engineers and Designers and not great.

More more info,
Please see:

http://youtu.be/xXYCaabNHCo

http://youtu.be/66FoxykeT0w

http://youtu.be/EWs4DsH3mdM

http://youtu.be/ndBgLKd3b1E

http://youtu.be/ygWeTWs4FnE

http://youtu.be/4zbSjfdjvuA

http://youtu.be/BV_bMQsDiS4

http://youtu.be/75Zx6zHeqbQ

http://youtu.be/5Hd2clwURlQ

http://youtu.be/_eKulxmdJQ4

http://youtu.be/00hxsRwAqxk

http://youtu.be/EF5fyCtfAfY

http://youtu.be/LApHhX3lc2k

The problem is,in Europe,CATIA V6 is as costly as VW Passat & in india,as costly as a Fiat 500 which are luxury products in India.
Plus yearly maintainace charges.Neither Student software Projects have got commercialised.I and most young designers in India cannot afford such expensive softwares.

So,I urge free Open Software community to urge these students to make these softwares freely available for those young aspiring Designers who cannot afford such expensive softwares.


With the most recent advent of 3D sketching Technology in CATIA V6,the Job of CAD department has also got very much easier.
Now they can give dimensions allmost straight away with less modifications,rather than creating the whole CAD model.This will save lot of time.
Also,Designers can now have better synchronisation/synergy between all Profile views (Front/Side/Back) automatically.

Last edited by Aman Shah on Tue May 21, 2013 4:59 am, edited 4 times in total.
User avatar nezumi
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Holy Grail! You again with your car design...
I cant imagine what one has to do to be banned here but I sure hope that one day you will do it.

Stop spamming with the same post in different threads. Administrator already told you this here:
viewtopic.php?f=137&t=109376#p257095

Whats more - in this very thread creator of Krita himself told you, quote: "Please -- Krita is not meant for "designing cars", whatever that is.". I dont think that you have EVER got ANY positive feedback on your "designing cars" posts yet you are still posting about it. Dont you see nobody is interested in it? Whats the point?
As for 3D sketching - You are sure that many never heard of it? Based on what? On fact that you didn't? This is nothing new - I saw demos of 3d sketching MANY years ago! Ilovesketch was presented around 2008.
This thread is about features possible to implement in Krita. You said yourself "its beyond the scope of Krita" - so why you are posting it?

Damnit man, devs and administrators have really strong nerves to let you still spam this useless stuff here.
User avatar Aman Shah
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You talk too rudely always.Your first few sentences made me not willimg to read your comment fully.
I am hearing about 3D sketching for the first Time,but I always imagined this type of User Interface.
Tools like Photoshop,Krita,Paint Tool SAI,TV Paint,etc are part of active Automotive industry too,but they have their own shortcomings.Just go to any automotive industry and check it yourself.I have already mentioned this few times, before.So,in that case you cannot say that "Please -- Krita is not meant for "designing cars".Product designers will laugh at you if you say them this.Actually,right now,I am laughing at your this Comment.
While multiple canvas windows Ideas is feasible in Krita,I am well aware that 3D sketching may not be applicable to be implemented in Krita.

 
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