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Krita for Windows? When?

ghevan
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Re: Krita for Windows? When?

Fri Mar 22, 2013 6:25 am
@nezumi
In my experience XP runs Krita better than Windows 8, although my experience on w8 is that it simply doesn't even start.
I'm just narrating the experience. I used Krita 2.5 on XP with no problems at all. I think for a widely used and supported OS like XP is good to have a report over recent versions of the software. But i may need to understand how to add the debugger to make the reports useful at all.


User avatar nezumi
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Re: Krita for Windows? When?

Fri Mar 22, 2013 3:19 pm
@ghevan - thats ok. I just cant believe that Windows XP is still widely used (I know that is but it is equal to using explorer as main browser...). I simply think that using VERY old systems on VERY old machines is a drag for software maintenance. Then people come and say "Krita is kind of slow on my 8 years old laptop". Well, guess what... It should be, because it is old, weak piece of junk with a 10 years old system. And dont get me wrong - I am not some rich person, but I do try to update my hardware to some standard. If you are serious about using computer you cant just stop 10 years back and expect everybody to look back forever. XP should die out already and devs focus should be on future not past. Just my point of view. I dont jump on every new thing that is out there (still using win7) but also hey, one cant expect to drive 100km/h using horse-drawn carriage...
User avatar Aman Shah
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Re: Krita for Windows? When?

Sun Mar 24, 2013 5:54 pm
Till Date,I could never use Krita on my new Tablet PC with Windows 8 Pro.!!!
Krita would never open a file except once where it opened a 100 * 100 pixels new page.Krita always crashed.And yes,the bug report programme does not work.I sincierly believe that Krita firstly is need of only two things:better lasso selection and 15 times better bugfree performance.New features may be worked on afterwards.

I was not in the discussion for many days because I couldn't try anything more on Krita once I shifted to Windows 8,so nothing to talk about.Neither I got a proper first hand tablet sketching experience with Krita,because previously I had tested Krita only on regular laptop on Windows vista and windows 7.

Anyway,keep going and all the best to the Krita team!

Last edited by Aman Shah on Sun Mar 24, 2013 6:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar boudewijn
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Re: Krita for Windows? When?

Sun Mar 24, 2013 5:58 pm
New version: http://heap.kogmbh.net/boud/krita_2.6.8.7.msi. Should work on more systems.
User avatar Aman Shah
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Re: Krita for Windows? When?

Sun Mar 24, 2013 6:02 pm
Thanks!

The link does not work properly at all.After opening the partially downloaded file,I am geting the following warning:

"This installation Package can not be opened. Contact the Application vendor to verify that this ia a valid windows installer package."

Last edited by Aman Shah on Tue Mar 26, 2013 9:31 am, edited 2 times in total.
valerievk
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Re: Krita for Windows? When?

Mon Mar 25, 2013 2:29 am
Aman Shah wrote:Till Date,I could never use Krita on my new Tablet PC with Windows 8 Pro.!!!
I sincierly believe that Krita firstly is need of only two things:better lasso selection and 15 times better bugfree performance.New features may be worked on afterwards.

Aman Shah, it isn't that simple at all. As you can clearly see from the join post on the first page right now, a better Windows build is at the top of the priority list for Krita. However, Krita simply lacks the developer resources to be able to implement it quickly.

Different developers have very different specializations when it comes to coding. For cars, it's just like how the wheel manufacturer won't be able to suddenly start producing engines. LukasT for example is very good at brush engines, whereas DmitryK is more concentrated on internal architecture. Most of these developers work in a strictly Linux environment, KDE to be specific. They simply don't have the expertise or environment to fix Windows-specific bugs. Heck, they don't even have Windows, period! To make things more complicated, some issues are specific to some hardware, like chipsets etc. Because of this, identifying issues is problematic. In short, unless you buy every single one of those devs the exact same model of tablet that you have, then very few of them have the ability to identify your problems and fix them.

Porting a program to another platform is very complicated even within the same-ish platform: a program on Windows XP may not work on Windows 8 and vice-versa. So it is quite complicated for the (mostly Linux KDE-based devs) to make a program that works also on Windows XP, Windows Vista, Windows 7 And Windows 8, regardless of hardware used. One of the Google Summer of Code projects in fact involves rewriting part of the infrastructure (OpenGL canvas) for better cross-platform support. That's just part of it, and all of these will require time and manpower. Telling all the other developpers to stop what they're doing is not only pointless, but rather disparaging of their work.

Also, although we understand that lasso tool is important for your long-term future career, Krita is being used by professional artists Right Now, including leading figures in the VFX industry. These artists have very different, "very important features I need right now" requirements than you do. There are a bunch of features I want to, but I'm not kidding myself, I may have to wait years before I get them, if ever. In fact, I waited years for Krita to become the program it is today. Krita is still a very new program compared to other series such as Photoshop, and will still be adding features years from now.
ghevan
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Re: Krita for Windows? When?

Mon Mar 25, 2013 5:21 am
@nezumi. I agree, we should move forward. I think that's one of he problems with closed source, things tend to linger a little more. Just taking IE6 as example D=

boudewijn wrote:New version: http://heap.kogmbh.net/boud/krita_2.6.8.7.msi. Should work on more systems.

Good I shall try that new version on the week. Any procedure on how to turn on debug mode in windows?

@Aman Shah It seems windows 8 speed is obscured by software issues. Krita is one of some programs that refuse to work.

@valerievk Krita needs more man power. I will help funding it once I get a stable income, but for the time being how can we help?


valerievk
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Re: Krita for Windows? When?

Mon Mar 25, 2013 6:11 am
@Ghevan: Not all of it is about money. :) These developers do some amazing work, if they were asking market price I don't think we'd be able to afford them. x D Most open source developers do what they do out of passion, so it's important to remember that and appreciate what they do (and be patient!). In fact, many Open Source projects don't Want to go multi-platform, because all it does is exponentially increase the number of bugs they have to fix, and then they have to deal with closed-source environments. I remember at least one big project where some devs complained that adding Windows support was their biggest mistake, because all it got them was a lot of whiny users, and no additional help. :\ (fortunately for us, the Krita devs care about getting their product into the hands of users who want to use it)

There are lots of ways to help even without coding, however. You can see that at the Join Krita page:
http://krita.org/join-krita

What all this does is get the non-coding work out of the developers' way so they can concentrate on what they want to do. Boud, for example, not only has to code features and bugs, but he also handles the marketing (which includes flying to other countries to discuss Krita with big companies that could support Krita), the communication with users, website contents, developer instructions and a lot of behind-the-scenes paperwork, which frankly is a ridiculous amount of work and competence required of one person. D: It's not surprising that he doesn't have the time for say, the wiki documentation and managing the merchandise shop. That's where other people could pitch in and contribute. Apart from the tutorials I did, I also wrote some of the new website pages and made summaries of past sponsored development efforts. Little things like that allow the devs to concentrate on other things.

As for Windows XP, I bought my computer when Vista came out. The experience was so traumatizing that I replaced it with Linux, and downgraded the one I then got at work with Windows XP. So, to answer your question of why XP is still around: it's because Vista took a long time to come out, and when it did, it was awful. By then, people were completely used to XP, too.
User avatar Aman Shah
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Re: Krita for Windows? When?

Mon Mar 25, 2013 6:13 am
valerievk wrote:
Aman Shah wrote:Till Date,I could never use Krita on my new Tablet PC with Windows 8 Pro.!!!
I sincierly believe that Krita firstly is need of only two things:better lasso selection and 15 times better bugfree performance.New features may be worked on afterwards.

Aman Shah, it isn't that simple at all. As you can clearly see from the join post on the first page right now, a better Windows build is at the top of the priority list for Krita. However, Krita simply lacks the developer resources to be able to implement it quickly.

Different developers have very different specializations when it comes to coding. For cars, it's just like how the wheel manufacturer won't be able to suddenly start producing engines. LukasT for example is very good at brush engines, whereas DmitryK is more concentrated on internal architecture. Most of these developers work in a strictly Linux environment, KDE to be specific. They simply don't have the expertise or environment to fix Windows-specific bugs. Heck, they don't even have Windows, period! To make things more complicated, some issues are specific to some hardware, like chipsets etc. Because of this, identifying issues is problematic. In short, unless you buy every single one of those devs the exact same model of tablet that you have, then very few of them have the ability to identify your problems and fix them.

Porting a program to another platform is very complicated even within the same-ish platform: a program on Windows XP may not work on Windows 8 and vice-versa. So it is quite complicated for the (mostly Linux KDE-based devs) to make a program that works also on Windows XP, Windows Vista, Windows 7 And Windows 8, regardless of hardware used. One of the Google Summer of Code projects in fact involves rewriting part of the infrastructure (OpenGL canvas) for better cross-platform support. That's just part of it, and all of these will require time and manpower. Telling all the other developpers to stop what they're doing is not only pointless, but rather disparaging of their work.

Also, although we understand that lasso tool is important for your long-term future career, Krita is being used by professional artists Right Now, including leading figures in the VFX industry. These artists have very different, "very important features I need right now" requirements than you do. There are a bunch of features I want to, but I'm not kidding myself, I may have to wait years before I get them, if ever. In fact, I waited years for Krita to become the program it is today. Krita is still a very new program compared to other series such as Photoshop, and will still be adding features years from now.


Thanks a lot!

I know that it isn't easy to make bug free programs by an independent organisation interested in helping artists.

I am just notifying the problems like "bug report programmes doesn't work""file cannot be opened".
Unless and Untill users don't contribute in reporting problems,how will Krita developers come to know about the problems?

No,not at all,I am not complaining like a customer,I have no right to complain as a customer,since Krita is a gift to me.
I am just reporting problems,just to make Krita a much better software and to fulfill the dreams of Krita community.

Car concept designers do not need any other softwares,other than those used by illustartors,comic artists,etc.The only thing they need is file size as big as available with photoshop(24000 * 12000) and a lasso tool exactly similar to what available in photoshop.I am very sure that some grahic designers,or comic illustrators need the same things which car designers need.
After a concept design is made,it is taken through many different stages:CAD,Optimisation,CFD Analysis,etc which is not done by a concept designer,but by an enginiering team using different softwares.

Last edited by Aman Shah on Mon Mar 25, 2013 6:46 am, edited 3 times in total.
User avatar nezumi
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Re: Krita for Windows? When?

Mon Mar 25, 2013 6:18 am
Last version works for me on Win7 with the same problems regarding reference picture docker - only PNG files are recognized.
User avatar boudewijn
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Re: Krita for Windows? When?

Mon Mar 25, 2013 8:25 am
Yes, there are no windows specific bug fixes. It's just a build created in a different dev env that I knew did not have the problem with the out-of-window-handles issue. I still don't know where that comes from, though.
User avatar Aman Shah
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Re: Krita for Windows? When?

Mon Mar 25, 2013 2:17 pm
Once,upon trying to start Krita on Windows 8,I got a warning once that Krita needs some kind of Calligra plugins to start properly.

It is interesting to note that I never installed any Calligra suite or any other KDE software other than krita on this new tablet computer.

I am not a programmer but I guess that this information should be useful to you.
User avatar Aman Shah
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Re: Krita for Windows? When?

Mon Mar 25, 2013 5:49 pm
http://heap.kogmbh.net/boud/krita_2.6.8.7.msi

The link works!
Probably, my internet Connection might be down afternoon time.Now its up.I blame the premium priced slow Internet connection.

But But But.......,the software compatibility issue with the Windows 8 remains the same except that when I run on Windows XP/Vista compatibilty Mode on Wondows 8,this time I can always open a new blank file of 100 * 100 pixels and view the general Krita layout which was generally not possible before on Windows 8.
But I can't ink down anything,not sure how the new versions performs with Windows 7 or vista or Xp.
Also,the Krita will not even open even the krita canvas layout,Untill I use Windows Troubleshoot Compatibilty mode settings.

Last edited by Aman Shah on Tue Mar 26, 2013 8:24 am, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar nezumi
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Re: Krita for Windows? When?

Mon Mar 25, 2013 9:16 pm
Aman Shah - concentrate, here is the question for you. What part you didn't understood previously about spamming and writing your own blog here?
Waaaait, I know in India is different - this is not India, ok? "when in Rome, do as the Romans do", remember?
It is quite simple - you write USEFUL information ON TOPIC, if you want to add something and your post is last one just edit it - there is no need to add new ones. This isnt rocket science, those are pretty simple rules that would help to everybody not interested in prices of slow internet connection in India and your other personal achievements that include using link that was working for everybody except from you. If you're not sure about something - no need to mention it. If I would start to write about things that I am not sure of then I would overtake internet. Lets keep to what we know - how about that?
Please man - why you have to write so much useless repetitive stuff? Yeah, yeah - I know you want to help - but you will not if one useful information is hidden in some colorful stories. It is so frustrating again to enter the forum and see you making a conversation with... yourself.
All that reminds me...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eBDi0iM2kcU

Last edited by nezumi on Tue Mar 26, 2013 5:36 am, edited 1 time in total.
valerievk
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Re: Krita for Windows? When?

Tue Mar 26, 2013 3:02 am
Aman Shah, please submit a proper bug report: :)
- If you can't access the bug report system from within the program, do it manually here:
https://bugs.kde.org/
- Please follow the instructions here:
http://userbase.kde.org/Asking_Question ... g_KDE_Bugs
Make sure nobody else has submitted the bug already.

To make bug reports that can actually be useful, please specify:
- Your system information
- The version of Krita you are using
- The steps to reproduce the crash.
- The error messages you received. "I got some error messages" is not useful information. Please copy/paste the text or take a screenshot.
- Ideally, find out how to run the program from a console in your system, so you can copy the error messages before the crash. I don't have Windows 8, so I don't know, you can perhaps google it.

The more precise your bug report, the more useful it is. Saying "I can't get Krita running properly, it has 15x too many bugs" is not useful information. :)

 
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