boudewijn wrote:Open source is not all about choice: open source is about having the opportunity to change the code. If you feel any of these things are needed, you need to get the code from https://phabricator.kde.org/source/krita/ and start implementing.

Whether or not a patch would be accepted into Krita is another thing, but people can always maintain a fork.

I have to admit that at one point I was ready to add another freehand brush tool that would only accept eraser presets just to get rid of the pressure, but then... That would be another case where pressure from people who want to turn Krita into a clone of other applications would have succeeded, and _every single time_ I've given in to that pressure, I've regretted it.

Honest inquiry: Please explain when you've given in and how exactly you've regretted it.
"Giving in" makes it sound like you removed a way of doing things you like, just so others can be happy?
Surely there are solutions to problems like this that everyone can comfortably live with?

Rokeo wrote:
Honest inquiry: Please explain when you've given in and how exactly you've regretted it.
"Giving in" makes it sound like you removed a way of doing things you like, just so others can be happy?
Surely there are solutions to problems like this that everyone can comfortably live with?

Because it increases the complexity of the program and said complexity will make it harder for us to maintain it, let alone add new features. Given how little funds we have, if maintaining a feature like this could cause a too large maintenance burden we'd have to remove it, because it'd be sucking funds. For that reason we want to be absolutely sure that there's no alternative way to approach the issue that causes less of a maintenance burden. To be able to figure that out we need to discuss things, and as Krita, but also as other programs change, the discussion will change constantly.

For example, that the 'E'raser key is a sticky key in photoshop is something that is fully new to me, and I used photoshop CS2 extensively. Sticky keys for this functionality will not even be remotely possible for the eraser as we are currently only capable of having sticky keys via an alternative shortcut scheme, that itself needs to be rewritten to begin with. Making an eraser tool does thus not automatically solve the problem you are having. You'd be very sad if you had gotten an eraser tool and discovered that there was no sticky keys functionality, wouldn't you?

TheraHedwig wrote:

Rokeo wrote:
Honest inquiry: Please explain when you've given in and how exactly you've regretted it.
"Giving in" makes it sound like you removed a way of doing things you like, just so others can be happy?
Surely there are solutions to problems like this that everyone can comfortably live with?

Because it increases the complexity of the program and said complexity will make it harder for us to maintain it, let alone add new features. Given how little funds we have, if maintaining a feature like this could cause a too large maintenance burden we'd have to remove it, because it'd be sucking funds. For that reason we want to be absolutely sure that there's no alternative way to approach the issue that causes less of a maintenance burden. To be able to figure that out we need to discuss things, and as Krita, but also as other programs change, the discussion will change constantly.

For example, that the 'E'raser key is a sticky key in photoshop is something that is fully new to me, and I used photoshop CS2 extensively. Sticky keys for this functionality will not even be remotely possible for the eraser as we are currently only capable of having sticky keys via an alternative shortcut scheme, that itself needs to be rewritten to begin with. Making an eraser tool does thus not automatically solve the problem you are having. You'd be very sad if you had gotten an eraser tool and discovered that there was no sticky keys functionality, wouldn't you?

As for the first paragraph:
Yes, fair point, I agree that this is indeed a problem that has to be kept in mind.

2nd:
Forgive me for asking, but isn't the "sticky key" mechanism like caps lock? Where you press and release, and then the button "sticks"? I'm not an expert in these things though.
What I mean (want) is actually the opposite, just having something active in the duration the key is down, and when the key is released the thing gets reverted. Is that called sticky keys? If so, then yeah, sure sticky keys


And for the problem you mentioned:
Actually sticky keys is the only thing I personally would need (along with the fixing of some other actual bugs, but I guess those will be resolved sooner or later seeing as they're just that, actual bugs).
I actually don't need or want an "eraser tool" (see, the discussion actually moved us forward haha) itself.
What I really want is being able to quickly erase a part of my image using a very specific brush. "Eraser mode" does not do the trick.

Being able to switch to a specific brush preset during the duration of me holding a button on my stylus; that is what I actually need. And that's 50% implemented already (conceptually I mean!! I know, I know, code is a lot more difficult I've heard! Sorry sorry!)

Anyway. I'm sure that 90% of the people who want a so called """"eraser tool"""" actually want the thing I described above: the ability to very quickly switch to something.
"Ten brushes" is actually a giant step towards that already.

Rokeo wrote:Anyway. I'm sure that 90% of the people who want a so called """"eraser tool"""" actually want the thing I described above: the ability to very quickly switch to something.
"Ten brushes" is actually a giant step towards that already.

Hi,

If it's just that, you can use the "Switch to previous preset" shortcut ("/" by default). For example in your workflow :
1. select the brush you want for drawing your lines (in the brush presset),
2. select the eraser you want (in the brush presset),
3. now you can toggle form brush to eraser just by using the shorcut...

mcoudert wrote:Hi,
If it's just that, you can use the "Switch to previous preset" shortcut ("/" by default). For example in your workflow :
1. select the brush you want for drawing your lines (in the brush presset),
2. select the eraser you want (in the brush presset),
3. now you can toggle form brush to eraser just by using the shorcut...

Yep, its good that at least we have this option, i actually work this way, but try explain it to everyone. And after changing one brush you need to repeat this actions, instead of just switching "e" and "b".
Same with ten brushes, after using one of the assigned on hotkey erasers, i want to press "b", and switch back to previous brush, without looking on witch of 10 keys i assigned my chalky brush, or pressing "\". This workflow is not repetitive.

Rokeo wrote:Anyway. I'm sure that 90% of the people who want a so called """"eraser tool"""" actually want the thing I described above: the ability to very quickly switch to something.
"Ten brushes" is actually a giant step towards that already.

This.

So, silly question, but if you have three brushes, assigned to hotkeys...

* you have brush1 selected
* you press hotkey2, you get brush2
* press hotkey2 again
* get brush1.

But what when...

* brush1 selected
* press hotkey2, get brush2
* press hotkey3, get brush3.

Now, with the above, what should happen if you press hotkey2 again?

TheraHedwig wrote:
* brush1 selected
* press hotkey2, get brush2
* press hotkey3, get brush3.

Now, with the above, what should happen if you press hotkey2 again?

I got your point :) Sure, logically pressing hotkey2 should switch to brush2.
So i tried to describe switching brushes as i see it: https://forum.kde.org/viewtopic.php?f=288&t=152755

Hito wrote:

TheraHedwig wrote:
* brush1 selected
* press hotkey2, get brush2
* press hotkey3, get brush3.

Now, with the above, what should happen if you press hotkey2 again?

I got your point Sure, logically pressing hotkey2 should switch to brush2.
So i tried to describe switching brushes as i see it: https://forum.kde.org/viewtopic.php?f=288&t=152755

I am not sure what I implied that needed to be gotten. I just wanted to double-check whether this little behaviour fix could work:

https://cgit.kde.org/krita.git/commit/? ... 63b1d71c80

TheraHedwig wrote:I am not sure what I implied that needed to be gotten. I just wanted to double-check whether this little behaviour fix could work:
https://cgit.kde.org/krita.git/commit/? ... 63b1d71c80

So, second click to the assigned brush will return you to previous preset? That actually really cool!

Hito wrote:

TheraHedwig wrote:I am not sure what I implied that needed to be gotten. I just wanted to double-check whether this little behaviour fix could work:
https://cgit.kde.org/krita.git/commit/? ... 63b1d71c80

So, second click to the assigned brush will return you to previous preset? That actually really cool!

Well, if you press a Ten Brushes hotkey while already having switched to that preset before, it'll switch to the preset your had before switching. It's not quite 'press-release' style brush switching, but it was an easy tweak to make in this case, and if it makes life easier...

TheraHedwig wrote:Well, if you press a Ten Brushes hotkey while already having switched to that preset before, it'll switch to the preset your had before switching. It's not quite 'press-release' style brush switching, but it was an easy tweak to make in this case, and if it makes life easier...

Just tried it in the new build, works great. The only problem is that it resetting brush size.

If you want it to prevent resetting brush size then you need to tick 'Temporarily Save Tweaks to Presets' in the brush settings: https://docs.krita.org/en/user_manual/l ... us-options

TheraHedwig wrote:If you want it to prevent resetting brush size then you need to tick 'Temporarily Save Tweaks to Presets' in the brush settings: https://docs.krita.org/en/user_manual/l ... us-options

Oh, that works, Thanks!
I just noticed it, because regular switch button "/" is saving size by default.

I have a related use case that I cannot find a workaround for without a dedicated Eraser tool.

If I select the eraser brush and then hit my shortcut key (D for Photoshop-like shortcut) to Reset Foreground and Background Color, or (X) Swap Foreground and Background Color, the Erase mode is turned off on the eraser brush. I then have to then hit “E” again when I want to use the eraser.

Neither using the Ten brushes nor Dedicated Eraser plugin helps.

My workflow is I have a pen button assigned to "Switch to last preset" so I can quickly toggle between brush and eraser. Many times I am in the eraser preset and hit the D key, have to undo (because I would have brushed with the eraser), instinctively toggle to the brush, continue painting, come back to eraser later and forgot that it is now in brush mode, hit undo again etc.

If I could save a brush preset with a selected color, I think that'll be an okay workaround.

Matt

@mattsoh -- It sounds like you potentially found a bug. Switching the foreground/backgroud should not be changing the eraser mode. I would have thought those would be two separate controls. Maybe there was someone that was complaining that it needed to work like that too. Someone would have to look at the code.

There is a code patch about saving a color to a brush preset, but that is turning out to be really confusing from a usability standpoint. That might not get done. For example should we allow people to be able to change colors with a "set" color. Right now there is no concept in code to "lock" a color to a brush. Some people might want to lock the color, while other people also might want to change it after it defaults to a color. We also allow people to temporarily save their changes to the brush settings, so changing the color on a color wheel would lose the default value the next time it was selected. The idea is nice, but it can create a lot of confusing situations that the developers need to figure out.