Okay, I'm now running KDE4 most of the time, and liking it a whole lot. But I have to admit that I want what I always wanted, which is... both. And for once, I would like to ask... what's wrong with that? Again, me no programmer... but intuitively, it seems like it should have been easy to provide for this from the beginning. Aaron Seigo wrote in Jan 08 (I'll get the link later) that KDE3 will probably be supported for years, and will be mainted (a security fix here, a bugfix there) as long as it has users.

Now understand that I am typing this on my Kubuntu KDE4.2.2 Desktop, which I love. Everytime I say something completmentary about KDE3, or how I would like to continue using it part of the time, people have interpreted it as an attack on KDE4. And this community conflict is built into the software by forcing us to take sides. I'm frequently wrong about stuff, but I'm not wrong about this. If people could have just put their KDE4 system next to their KDE3 system, if they could have learned to use it without burning a major bridge, a world of hurt could have been avoided.

And so...?

sayakb wrote: And so...?

Ummmmmmm...what? Your avatar is awesome, by the way.

I guess you're asking me what I'm going to do about it? Well, I guess that's good question. If the past, I would rave like a maniac about how someone should fork KDE3, but that's not doing anything, and I don't think a fork is necessary. I'm not a programmer, and my bipolar disorder makes reading computer books a major ordeal, however:

If someone else can mastermind a solution, I'll gladly follow orders. If there's a whole lot of repetative cut and paste or renaming of files to be done, I'm your man. PM me.[hr]

blackbelt_jones wrote:

sayakb wrote: And so...?

Ummmmmmm...what? Your avatar is awesome, by the way.

I guess you're asking me what I'm going to do about it? Well, I guess that's good question. If the past, I would rave like a maniac about how someone should fork KDE3, but that's not doing anything, and I don't think a fork is necessary or desirable. I'm not a programmer, and my bipolar disorder makes reading computer books a major ordeal, however:

If someone else can mastermind a solution, I'll gladly follow orders. If there's a whole lot of repetative cut and paste or renaming of files to be done, I'm your man. PM me.

Hey, wait I have an idea! The Konstruct utility builds KDE3 in ~, instead of in /usr/bin. So maybe, if I build KDE3 in my home directory, I can launch 3/4 with two seperate commands in .xinitrc! Something like:

/usr/bin/startkde

~/startkde


The paths would probably be more complicated. But you get the idea, right?

This seems priomising. I wouldn't have come up with it if you hadn't pushed me. God bless you, sir, and your magic drumroll!

Incidentally, here's a screenshot of Vector Linux trying to open both KDEs at once! You can see both panels, and both menus.

http://i546.photobucket.com/albums/hh43 ... hot2-1.png[hr]http://techbase.kde.org/Getting_Started/Build/konstruct

By default Konstruct installs to your home directory which means you don't have to possess root privileges or risk to damage your system or affect another KDE.

PAYDIRT!:thumbs_up:

Are you just asking for having KDE 4 and KDE 3 on the same system? And that you can choose in the login manager which session to use?

Pconfig wrote:Are you just asking for having KDE 4 and KDE 3 on the same system? And that you can choose in the login manager which session to use?

I'm not really asking for anything. My problem appears to be solved, and maybe I can write a tutorial that will make other other people happy.

I don't know how easy or hard it would have been, but I strongly believe that if the software could have been rolled out that way by default, the rollout could have been a lot smoother for all concerned. But this is not the time for that discussion. We should talk about all the things that could have gone better later, when no one is feeling threatened or defensive any more... but before KDE5! I'm pretty sure that in the current atmosphere if I start to talk about how conflict could be avoided in the future, someone is going to think I'm trying to stir up conflict, because that's the way things are right now. I'm not, so let's table this.[hr]I will say this much. As far as I know,, and for purposes of future discussion, KDE did not make any mistakes in introducing KDE4. They did what has always worked. That's not a mistake. In lieu of being able to predict the future, that's what you're supposed to do. What works.

I know I've said differently before, but I'm seeing clearer now. They did everything right. And the software rocks. This is obviously a hugely successful project, and any discussion of how to do things better can wait until after the victory laps, which have been long delayed and are well deserved.

Please do not multi post, but edit your older post to update it if necessary.

I have merged your consecutive posts to a single one. Please note this in future.

OK Thanks.

Pconfig wrote:Are you just asking for having KDE 4 and KDE 3 on the same system? And that you can choose in the login manager which session to use?

Hopefully I've made it clear that I'm not interested in pointing fingers, so I'll go ahead and answer.

What I'm asking is that we all examine the possibility that exactly what you've described should be the standard for the future, built in from the very beginning. Build it into KDE5 and the rollout of KDE6 will be a lot more comfortable, community-positive, and fun. That's what I'm asking.

If you want to be free to be really innovate, there's got to be some way of building in some breathing room. Nobody made any mistakes, but the system needs to be revised, because the level of innovation exceeded what the system can accomodate. It's like a cage match. Here comes KDE4, carving a path of destruction. There goes KDE3, obstructing progress. It's thunderdome. Whether you prefer the old or the new, your preference automatically makes you a threat to someone else.

When you're fighting for the one available spot on the login manager, everyone loses their minds. Last weekend I got banned from the Kubuntu forum. Make no mistake, it was for being a ****, because I got mad. In the end, I deserved it. But the whole thing started when I posted a link to an article that explaned that KDE3 would be supported for a long time to come, and was angrily denounced from all sides as a troll posting anti-KDE4 propaganda. That would probably be a surprise to the author of the article, Aaron Seigo. The insanity is built into the system. I think we should build it out. Is that a word?