Oh I see. Thanks

Sorry if I sound rude, because it's not meant to be.

This thread sounds like asking someone whom is the best dealer for
Model T Ford.

KDE 3.5.10 was great in its time, sorry brilliant!

But please guys, we now have 4.4 which is just jaw dropping. No more feeble
excuses anymore to our MS Windows using friends. We have something to be really proud of.

Sorry for slight rant!

After about 1 and a half to 2 years having finally surrendered to KDE4, I had occasion to use the Slax 6.1.2 live CD again, and wow, using KDE3 felt good! Didn't have to think about the desktop all the time. So that's it for me, I've finally made a decision. And now I've got the Trinity Kubuntu running on everything that's got a hard drive.

I'm sorry KDE4. It's not you; it's me. The team did great work on you, but I'm not doing great work with you. I need more structure, less options to mess around with. It's really my fault, but as unfair as it is, I'm staying. You're the one that has to go.

But are all the applications made for KDE4 running properly? Automatic upgrades and all this?

Arran wrote:But are all the applications made for KDE4 running properly? Automatic upgrades and all this?

Well, it hasn't been that long. They work. KDE4 apps I've run are Kdenlive, Ktorrent and Dolphin. I don't seem to enough resources to run Kdenlive that good, but I think it works as well as on KDE4. When you install it, you install the KDE4 libraries. So it's running off KDE4, you're just using KDE3 to launch it, exactly like you're launching KDE applications from Gnome.

I don't know about automatic upgrades. I do an apt-get upgrade every now and then, and I'm not paying all that much attention to what's getting upgraded. The interesting thing is that the applications have all been renamed. Konqueror is konqueror-kde3, but you can launch it as konqueror inside the KDE3 Desktop. Anywhere else, you have to use the full command.

I think they should just fork it for real, rename everything, and just lose these problems, and the perception of competing with KDE4 for space. A distro should be able to make trinity available without becoming "The Trinity Distro" There's no reason why Trinity shouldn't be just another apt-get for Debian-based distros, like LXDE, IceWM, FVWM. But I'm sure that whatever Trinity needs to do to become viable, it's going to be done, however long it takes. Because these people are like me. They're never never never going to let go. I've been struggling, really struggling to get my head around KDE4 for something like three years. I used to hate KDE4, but I got over that a long time ago. I respect KDE4. But I loooooove KDE3. This isn't about hate, this is about love.

I've seen angry people badmouthing KDE4 in here. I was one of them a long time ago, but now it makes me sick at heart. It's just wrong. We don't need to fight. But we do need to fork. KDE4 was inevitable and necessary. The traditional desktop metaphor needed to be shattered. But it also needs to be preserved. This is going to to happen.

Arran wrote:But are all the applications made for KDE4 running properly? Automatic upgrades and all this?

Automatic upgrades are the responsibility of the distro, not the de

google01103 wrote:

Arran wrote:But are all the applications made for KDE4 running properly? Automatic upgrades and all this?

Automatic upgrades are the responsibility of the distro, not the de

Well, yeah, but I'd say that this is the rare case where the de and the distro are the same. I dunno. Typing "apt-get dist-upgrade" isn't a problem for me.

The best KDE3 distro is of course openSUSE, this is a LiveCD:
http://susestudio.com/download/2cd88b81 ... 1.0.14.iso

Yes, all automatic upgrades will work properly.

Please Note the opensuse .iso image linked to above, at 1.5 GB, is a live DVD, not a live CD. If you don't have a DVD burner or blank DVDs on hand, you'll want to know that. Opensuse does have a KDE3 repository, and I've recently installed KDE3 from there. It was pretty good, though I don't know much about running KDE4 applications with KDE3 in opensuse.

Kubuntu-Trinity strives to be KDE4 compatible, and that's one of the the things I like about it. I've run Kdenlive, Ktorrent-KDE4 and Dolphin from KDE3, all installed with a simple apt-get. I've had some problems with Ktorrent confusing configurations, so, if you want to run a particular application in KDE4, I recommend apt-get removing the KDE3 version first. Use apt-cache search to find the correct name for removing the file (ktorrent-kde3).

Also, I do believe that automatic upgrade is available for Kubuntu Trinity, I've just never paid much attention to it, and don't know anything about it.

though I don't know much about running KDE4 applications with KDE3 in opensuse.

There are no problems with it.

Kubuntu-Trinity strives to be KDE4 compatible, and that's one of the the things I like about it. I've run Kdenlive, Ktorrent-KDE4 and Dolphin from KDE3, all installed with a simple apt-get. I've had some problems with Ktorrent confusing configurations, so, if you want to run a particular application in KDE4, I recommend apt-get removing the KDE3 version first.

These problems are Trinity/Debian specific, there are no such issues in openSUSE.

I had some issues when I tried KDE3 in Opensuse last week for a few days. Notably, Konqueror wouldn't automatically mount removable devices, so I had to mount them manually in konsole. I didn't use the live DVD, I used the network installer, installed XFCE first, then I added the KDE3 repositories, and then installed the desktop. Incidentally, I really liked the look and feel of opensuse's XFCE desktop. Overall, I'd say that running KDE3 in both Opensuse and Kubuntu had some minor issues for me that were easy to work around.

KDE 3 used HAL, so you might need to install that by hand, as current generation distributions don't install it by default.

There's an ongoing discussion on the opensuse-factory ML regarding the lack of automounting of removable drives in KDE3. According to some of the messages there, it's something that needs to be fixed in KDE3 rather than lower in the stack.

My choice for best KDE3 distribution is Slax. Slax 6.1.2 is still available for download, and provides a KDE3 era OS in a secure live form. That means I'm not dependent on anybody to keep my system functional. There are no issues around continued support of HAL, for example. There might be security issues around installing an OS that hasn't been upgraded for a few years on your hard drive, but, as we all know, a compromised live system can be fixed with a reboot. So I'm golden. I can run KDE3 on my PC forever, or at least until my PC is no longer a PC. I run it from a flash drive, and mount an ext3 partition on the hard drive as /home , and use the adduser command to create (or recreate) a normal user account. So I keep all my configuration data and my ~home directory intact.

At http://www.kiaragnulinux.blogspot.com, you can download KIARA, my own Slax based live distro. It's a good example of what anyone can do fairly easily with Slax. To the basic 200MB Slax image I added applications from Slackware 12.2, using a script called 1gz2lzm that turns Slackware packages into Slax packages. including emacs, sudo, gimp, irssi, lynx, and virtually all the KDE3 modules for a complete desktop, and then I keep it current with the latest versions of Firefox, Seamonkey, Thunderbird, and also Opera and Adobe Flashplayer. For me, having the latest Mozilla web applications really makes my system feel new, no matter how old everything else is. You get hooked on having the latest applications, but the applications from from Slax 6.1.2 and Slackware 12.2 are perfectly usable. The only application where I can detect a small difference in functionality is The Gimp. I couldn't tell you how emacs is different, or irssi, or xchat, though more advanced users of these applications may have a different experience.

You can't use it for everything. It's great for general desktop stuff but I need to boot my installed harddrive system (currently Kubuntu) for things that require more advanced applications, e.g. editing video.

When I can run Trinity with the latest stable version of Slackware, I'll be ready to put all my eggs in Trinity's basket. I wouldn't bet against that day coming. Porteus 1.0 is out (formerly "Slax Remix"), and it's running a gorgeous Trinity desktop with applications ported from Slackware 13.37, but right now it is buggy and convoluted. Changes have been made to the basic Slax structure that seem to have made it less versatile. They'll get it right if they keep trying, and that's what usually happens.

blackbelt_jones wrote:I had some issues when I tried KDE3 in Opensuse last week for a few days. Notably, Konqueror wouldn't automatically mount removable devices, so I had to mount them manually in konsole. I didn't use the live DVD, I used the network installer, installed XFCE first, then I added the KDE3 repositories, and then installed the desktop. Incidentally, I really liked the look and feel of opensuse's XFCE desktop. Overall, I'd say that running KDE3 in both Opensuse and Kubuntu had some minor issues for me that were easy to work around.

It seems you did not start hal service in Yast, as described here: http://en.opensuse.org/KDE3