I was a bit surprised not to see anything about this topic here, hope I'm in the right place. My experiences are disastrous. I tried KDE 4 for about a day (maybe it's not enough, but I need to work with my computer and don't have time to figure things out). I upgraded my Mandriva system from 2008.1 to 2009.0 and didn't even know that I was to test KDE 4.1 (or is it 4.2? Sorry, I don't recall).

The maybe worst thing: After a while of playing around, the K-Menu disappeared completely (I believe when I switched it from the new style to the old style, which I prefer). I could reload it as a miniprogram, but then only the new style, not the old one. Everytime I did that (installed the old style menu) and klicked on it, the whole desktop disappeared and came back after a while without any of the menus.
No, worse was this: KMail does not import most of my KDE3 settings. I have about 30 pop-accounts, one imap-account and about 10 smtp-accounts set up. Now I shall enter everything by hand again? No way! So I copied the kmailrc file and the rest from .kde/share/apps/kmail, which gave me at least the pop accounts, but no smtp-accounts back. It rained error messages that asked me to arrange for some sending account, even though I hadn't sent a message, and I was asked for passwords time and again, even though I wanted to get them saved.
kwallet didn't work, i.e. the password that I enter under KDE 3.5.10 does not work under KDE 4. This problem occured also when I tried to use krusader (opening a FTP connection) - I just didn't get it to load the kwallet, because it thought the password is wrong.
I did not try moving my several hundreds of addresses from the kde3-folder to the kde4-folder, maybe that would have worked. I'm pretty sure that I have lost the distribution lists, since I lost them already earlier when there was a major update in kaddressbook. I'm still angry about that.
I missed a new version of konqueror (as file manager), dolphin can't do half the things konqueror does for me under KDE 3.x - at least I didn't find all the rest. Did I miss konqueror? The version that was run initially was the one I used under KDE 3, in other words no update.
OpenOffice 3 doesn't have any KDE-integration - I hope this is only temporarily. One thing I really enjoyed about KDE 3 were the new file dialogues which allowed to set shortcuts, and it's really helpful to use those in OpenOffice. I have a very complex file structure, as I handle a lot of different things with the help of my computer. It's boring to go back to the main folder and then click my way through to the destination where I want to find my files.
I got tons of shocks when trying Amarok. I used it under KDE 3 for a long time, but the new version under KDE4 is a catastrophy. The script for migrating the databse doesn't work, I'm told to check the log, but not, how to go about it (neither am I told where the logs are, nor how to read them - I found them, but can't open them with regular readers). So, all my settings, everything I did to make it "complete" (adding a grade to each song, adding lyrics and additional info to the tracks, BTW some 10000 or so) was inaccessible this way. Further, Amarok couldn't be adjusted properly. The icons were all too large, and it crashed while I was not using it (pause), leaving no debug trace at all.
I tried to add a second control bar (I had two in my 3.5 setting), but... First of all, the second one always was positioned at the top of the screen, but I wanted it at the bottom, just above the main control bar. But when moving it down, it covers completely the main control bar. No chance.
In this main control bar, it shows the open windows of all the apps. As I have 8 GB RAM and a powerful machine, I leave many apps open. In KDE 3, I can distinguish which ones are open, even if there are more than 20 windows open and 20 mini programms plus a few shortcuts open (screen width 1600 pixels). In KDE 4, there was no way to find out just by looking which window is which of the tabs while there were only half the things open - I had to move over with the mouse to get some info. I noticed that every single window got its own tab. In KDE 3, I could choose whether this is the case or whether all windows of one app would be put together.

As said, I need my PC to do a lot of work. It helps me to organize the infos that I collect, and the data that I produce. It helps me in creating useful information. With KDE 4, I don't see this happening.
I read somewhere that a tool for migration from KDE 3 to KDE 4 is in development, but no links or so. Is there something that would do that? Shouldn't that be there, before the first version of KDE 4 is released? In my view, everything that's new stands and falls with a smooth transition. I'm really willing and actually eager to find out and make use of all the new features in KDE 4, but as it is, there's no chance for me to really do it.
What I really dislike is this: some developer (forgot who) announced that they stop developing the KDE3 version of their app and continue only for the KDE4 version. It was one of the apps I use regularly. Now, if you stop supporting your old version, you need to provide some functioning means to get the old data across to the other side, right?
And one more word: I contribute some money here and there to the open source community. I buy my Mandriva (Powerpack subscription), and I would love to do some developing, too, if I had the time and knowledge. I just want to say: I am not one of those guys who think that "free" means free of cost.

DrMartinus wrote:I was a bit surprised not to see anything about this topic here, hope I'm in the right place. My experiences are disastrous. I tried KDE 4 for about a day (iption), and I would love to do some developing, too, if I had the time and knowledge. I just want to say: I am not one of those guys who think that "free" means free of cost.

My opinion about new KDE4 is the same. I like 3.5, it has much more options...

What DrMartinus and RobinHood have written enforces my impression of KDE 4 being the "Vista" of KDE. Why did it have to be that way?

It's a rewrite from scrath,
Dr Martinus, i'm currently using Mandriva 2009 and I didn't have those issues, I think it's a upgrade problem ( I never upgrade, always format the / partition and reinstall everything, and for that i have a separate /data and /home partitions. )
KDE 4 was for really early adopters, KDE 4.1 still is for early adopters. you can do *almost* everything that you did in 3.x séries, but not all of them. the 4.2 version will be a great improvement over the 4.1 and contains *tons* of new features that users miss from 3.x séries and it will be faster ( don't know if they will use Qt 4.5 too, but if 4.5 is used, it will be faster ++ ).
There's always the choice for 3.5 till all features are ready, but belive me, the features that are on both, 4.1 kicks 3.5 out

Tomaz wrote: 4.1 kicks 3.5 out

I didn't find where it kick 3.5. If you are looking for "cosmetics" improvemenet than maybe...

You always have to consider that KDE 4.0 is not the successor of KDE 3.5. KDE 4 is the successor of KDE 3, but it is almost completely rewritten. So it has not reached a stable stage as KDE 3.5.*, but it matures. There were huge improvements from KDE 4.0 to KDE 4.1 and I think there is also a huge step from KDE 4.1 to 4.2. I am watching progress in trunk.

What I really dislike is this: some developer (forgot who) announced that they stop developing the KDE3 version of their app and continue only for the KDE4 version. It was one of the apps I use regularly. Now, if you stop supporting your old version, you need to provide some functioning means to get the old data across to the other side, right?

Concerning the KDE3 branch in KDE SVN, there were/are a lot of bug fixes in the last month/years since the start of the development of KDE 4. But AFAIK there won't be any new features.

I also read about migration apps on kde-devel mailinglist. Perhaps you can have a look on the archives.

Cheers, m.

Tomaz wrote:Dr Martinus, i'm currently using Mandriva 2009 and I didn't have those issues, I think it's a upgrade problem ( I never upgrade, always format the / partition and reinstall everything, and for that i have a separate /data and /home partitions. )

I don't like this statement, sorry. Of course you can do a new install, that's up to you. But, firstly, if the software offers an upgrade, it should do that properly, and secondly, I doubt that your KMail for instance adopted the settings of your former 3.x version properly without any interference by you. Or did it? I really would like to know. Or don't you use KMail?
Regarding fresh install: I did that too often to know that I can't afford it. It would take me about two to three days to get more or less the same state of the system that I had before, and I can't spare that time (once I spent an entire week until everything was back in a workable state; luckily I had a week off from work. I was wise enough to do that during that period). I work with my computer, i.e. I earn my money with it. I have software installed that has to run when I start the computer; it's not ok if I have to search for functions which I use regularly and don't find them, because they are either hidden or non-existent, and it's also not ok if that software doesn't run at all.
What I have seen of KDE 4 so far is just useless.

I doubt that your KMail for instance adopted the settings of your former 3.x version properly without any interference by you.

M-m, kmail and ktorrent worked quit well with minimal interaction from my side when I did

Code: Select all

cp -f .kde .kde4

There was some issues with konqueror and kopete and a big trouble with akregator through.

DrMartinus wrote:I doubt that your KMail for instance adopted the settings of your former 3.x version properly without any interference by you. Or did it? I really would like to know. Or don't you use KMail?

It did for me, once I had copied the files from the .kde dir to the .kde4 one that Kubuntu used. I didn't have to do anything when I ditched Kubuntu in favor of OpenSuse either.

I don't know how Mandriva has set it all up (has never tried that particular distro), but if it doesn't work properly I would call that a Mandriva bug.

DrMartinus wrote:Regarding fresh install: I did that too often to know that I can't afford it.

I'm the other way around...I know I can't afford to do a dist-upgrade, because they in my experience always messes something up that wouldn't show its ugly face with a clean install (speaking only from a Suse and Kubuntu background here, might be different elsewhere).

yes, I do use kmail. ( sorry if I seem a little not humble on my post, my english is not what it should be and sometimes I don`t choose the correct words).
but, if mandriva didn`t upgrade well from kde 3.5 to kde 4.x, I really don`t find a relationship with the kde code.
I don`t like to blame anyone, but it looks like a bug on the mandriva upgrading system, not with kde.

Some distributors use a different user-local directory for KDE3 and KDE4, e.g. ~/.kde for KDE3 and ~/.kde4 for KDE4 but either forget to automatically copy the old configuration and data to the new location or do not mention this as a manual upgrade task in their upgrade instructions (or probably they are not read carefully enough).

Cheers,
_

Mine OS is FreeBSD and I have both KDE 3.5.10 and KDE 4.1.1 and about KMail there are no problem with copy settings from 3 to 4. Maybe is problem Mandriva.

DrMartinus wrote:I don't like this statement, sorry. Of course you can do a new install, that's up to you. But, firstly, if the software offers an upgrade, it should do that properly

Indeed, but that issue is related to Mandriva, not to KDE. I have done upgrades on mandriva and opensuse in the past, and most of the times the resulting system wasn't as stable/smooth as it should be. So now i setup my /home directory on a seperate partition and do a fresh install when upgrading to a newer version. Because /home is seperate, all my personal settings are kept.

KDE 3.5 Has a big problem with the Key shortcuts, you cannot even CTL+C/CTL+V with it!

odd, i never had problems with key shortcuts in any kde version.