How to modify Kmail composer's templates for RE or FWD to looks like in Outlook?

If I reply to an e-mail or if I want to forward it, then original message is reformated into plaintext and pasted to the end of the message. I don't want to reformat original massage, but I'd like to keep it as in original (I don't want to attach it as attachement as well). To keep original message untached is good if you had 10 replays to your message and you want to track a history.

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Nicco wrote:How to modify Kmail composer's templates for RE or FWD to looks like in Outlook?

If I reply to an e-mail or if I want to forward it, then original message is reformated into plaintext and pasted to the end of the message. I don't want to reformat original massage, but I'd like to keep it as in original (I don't want to attach it as attachement as well). To keep original message untached is good if you had 10 replays to your message and you want to track a history.

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It's a missing feature in Kmail not to format html messages to plain text. There have been some discussion around, but I think it's a pity indeed. At this moment it's not possible...

mithras wrote:It's a missing feature in Kmail not to format html messages to plain text. There have been some discussion around, but I think it's a pity indeed. At this moment it's not possible...

Thanks for reply, but is there a way how to discuss missing features with KMail developers? Or list of missing features?
I see a lot of thinks to improve.

Nicco wrote:

mithras wrote:It's a missing feature in Kmail not to format html messages to plain text. There have been some discussion around, but I think it's a pity indeed. At this moment it's not possible...

Thanks for reply, but is there a way how to discuss missing features with KMail developers? Or list of missing features?
I see a lot of thinks to improve.

Check the kdepim-users list on http://www.kde.org/mailinglists

I have always wondered if it would not be possible to create a separate HTML editor and then embed it into Kmail. In a proper way, I mean. The current way of invoking and external editor is a bit 80's-like....

But yeah, no proper HTML support is a real deal breaker for me. So must admit I am using Thunderbird until that gets fixed....

I have read some replies from developers in this thread: http://www.kde-forum.org/artikel/16145/ ... html+reply
It seems like Kmail is run by people who despise all forms of HTML email. They do not understand that everybody else except themselves and their circle of contacts don't care about HTML email. I have read comments saying that nobody uses HTML in email and if they do, then they do not know what they are doing. I do understand the possible security concerns and I will respect their position, but they obviously have never been employed by a company of any size. They do not understand that having no HTML in replies or forwarding is a deal-breaker for any business that may want to use KDE, not to mention many people's personal email. This must have hampered the adoption of linux in SMB's. In the real world, HOW you present yourself is just as important, if not more so, than WHAT you present. If some idiot manager, who always seems to have a lot of power, is looking at two proposals and one of them has replies in plain text, I would bet my life savings that the one that look nice will be picked.
We are not asking to have this always turned on. When I reply to any mailing list or to a developer, I always do so in plain text and bottom-post. When I reply to an email from my boss, I *must* keep all past formatting and top-post. That is the way 99% of businesses operate. That is true and no amount of ******** (complaining) about it will change it.
It seems the only way to get this feature available is to file a bug report. If enough people do it, maybe they will actually understand that many people want this option.

HumulusLupulus wrote:It seems the only way to get this feature available is to file a bug report. If enough people do it, maybe they will actually understand that many people want this option.

Of course, some nice bug reports always help. But in KDEPIM there clearly is a lack of manpower.
Priority is to get KDEPIM stable and solid. And when there are no people left implementing wishes/usability issues, what to do?

To make it short, i don't think the developers really didn't understand that. They just have higher concerns (IMAP issues, to name one).

Much as I respect the developers, when you browse through the mailing lists, you will see the utter contempt with which people are treated that request HTML formatting to be implemented. Maybe that has changed lately, but I am pretty sure that HTML support has been consciously left out of development plans for a good many years.

To each his own, I am not losing any sleep over it, especially now that Thunderbird 3 does all I need it to do. But Kmail has missed an important window of opportunity to establish itself as a serious mail client, that's for sure.

neverendingo wrote:Priority is to get KDEPIM stable and solid. And when there are no people left implementing wishes/usability issues, what to do?

To make it short, i don't think the developers really didn't understand that. They just have higher concerns (IMAP issues, to name one).

I don't understand everything, I can admit that. It's just that I have never seen this issue even under consideration. Everything I have read gives me the notion that this feature will never happen. To me (and others) it seems such a simple and obvious thing that is part of a full-featured email client. I don't want to sound mean, but I am frustrated.
Is there a roadmap for Kmail? I looked on the Kontact and KDE-PIM pages but I could not find it. I would help but my coding skills are limited to COBOL and VisualBasic.

It clearly is under consideration, you can be sure. Just take a look at the mailings lists archive or query bug.kde.org for that.

But i didn't want to say you shouldn't file bug reports, sure Just be sure they don't already exist.

HumulusLupulus wrote:
I don't understand everything, I can admit that. It's just that I have never seen this issue even under consideration. Everything I have read gives me the notion that this feature will never happen. To me (and others) it seems such a simple and obvious thing that is part of a full-featured email client. I don't want to sound mean, but I am frustrated.

Now, I can understand frustration but...(and I'm not a Konact developer) consider:

1. The Kontact team is under-manned. They have to prioritize.
2. K-mail can read html-formatted mails just fine.
3. You can compose new mails using rich text formating options, that (in my experience at least) looks as intended in other clients (using KDE 4.1.82 and Kmail 1.10.92).
4. What's missing is replying and preserving the formatting. I agree that can be a showstopper in some cases, but considering 2 and 3 I think that is mostly (now at least) a consequence of 1 and not a case of "Html mails are evil!"

Kryten2X4B wrote:1. The Kontact team is under-manned. They have to prioritize.
2. K-mail can read html-formatted mails just fine.
3. You can compose new mails using rich text formating options, that (in my experience at least) looks as intended in other clients (using KDE 4.1.82 and Kmail 1.10.92).
4. What's missing is replying and preserving the formatting. I agree that can be a showstopper in some cases, but considering 2 and 3 I think that is mostly (now at least) a consequence of 1 and not a case of "Html mails are evil!"

I find the rest of Kmail works almost perfectly for me. I would like to send pictures and attachments inline, but that is more of a wish-list thing. I like the way it integrates with all parts of my KDE desktop and apps, ClamAV gets to work with a couple of mouse clicks, creating an HTML email works just fine (except for my wish list thing), viewing all the **** my mother sends me is easy since it goes to a separate folder (she's the kind that sends viral videos and 'Jesus loves you with flowers and a poem in flashplayer' stuff all over the internet), it receives inline pictures with no problem. I have never had any problems with getting to my email accounts whether they be from gmail, my ISP, or my website. I like Kmail, I like KDE-PIM, very useful stuff there. I think that as a whole, a really great job has been done on it. It's just that I look at that plain text in every single reply and it really bugs me that it doesn't look the way I received it.

I really agree with you to all considerations of kmail present and future. Maybe is good to write down what we like and non't like in Kmail.
But after thinking about it for a while :clock: I realize that I'm descibing something what exists already :-P . Yes, for me is the Outlook the best e-mail client :-$.
I don't like M$ :-@, but what we all know, M$ is King in office :lightbulb: . And office environment I mean.
For gmail I use web interface, that's fine for me, but in office I realy need functionality which Outlook provides.

1) Perfect html view
2) no changes in RE, RE to all, FWD in previous e-mails

my text...

----Original message-----
From:...
To:....
Copy:...
Subject:....
Date:....

not changed HTML history

3) not to delete empty lines when composing HTML




I can't believe. :-@ It shouldn't be so difficult. It is just simple HTML markup support.
I'm writing this reply in nice HTML editor (but it quotes original messages as text only :thumbs_down:)
People work on Konqueror or Webkit, but they are not able to put good HTMP composer into Kmail.
It is not something which needs to be invented and doesn't exist now - it exists already!


See at Zimbra Desktop :email: from Yahoo - great HTML support :kiss: and it is open source, so Developers, please have a look.

There is also Thunderbird quite fine, but it doesn't solve my point 2) because in RE for example, it puts original message in odd stanza, marked by blue vertical line so it is really terrible after couple of e-mail exchanges :-S.