Hi,

when I look at the new KF5 I like it the theme is decent and nice only one picture catch my eyes. the plasma cashew symbol.



Why the symbol in the left, top desktop corner is neaded? With right click you get the same functionality and in the panel there is also the edit symbol (looks much better)

andreas_k wrote:Hi,

when I look at the new KF5 I like it the theme is decent and nice only one picture catch my eyes. the plasma cashew symbol.



Why the symbol in the left, top desktop corner is neaded? With right click you get the same functionality and in the panel there is also the edit symbol (looks much better)

Context menus should never be the only way to get to an important function (see also the HIG) because one cannot rely on users to find them.
The problem with the panel is that users might (accidentally) remove the panel, leaving them with no obvious function to bring it back.

Does it work with a plasma icon (because you start the configuration of plasma the desktop) in an plasmoid, so in the standard view, like you start kde first time, the plasma icon was in the corner, but it is an plasmoid so people how know to add and remove plasmoids can remove the plasma icon plasmoid.

I think the topic is wrong and the place to talk it not the right place.

I fill a bug report because it is no design question. https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=338243

The thread could be closed.

colomar wrote:

andreas_k wrote:Hi,

when I look at the new KF5 I like it the theme is decent and nice only one picture catch my eyes. the plasma cashew symbol.



Why the symbol in the left, top desktop corner is neaded? With right click you get the same functionality and in the panel there is also the edit symbol (looks much better)

Context menus should never be the only way to get to an important function (see also the HIG) because one cannot rely on users to find them.
The problem with the panel is that users might (accidentally) remove the panel, leaving them with no obvious function to bring it back.

Code: Select all

if (plasmaPanelCount < 1) {
    showCashew(location);
} else {
    hideCashew();
}

Oh and if even that is completely unthinkable, what about at least making the cashew look less of a some kind of toolbar stub?

I have to agree that it does look out of place on the corner. The original cashew at least went semi-circler so it looked less conspicuous. How about we cut the corner off like so:



It is quite androidy I suppose, but hey, at least people will recognise it for what it is.

i feel like it needs more blending of some kind so it doesn't look so out of place, the old one had a nice sort of blend to it. but perhaps that is just me, i'm not an artist/design person.

sreich wrote:i feel like it needs more blending of some kind so it doesn't look so out of place, the old one had a nice sort of blend to it. but perhaps that is just me, i'm not an artist/design person.

I wanted to contribute to this discussion by giving the menu a different treatment. Once you hover over the corner, you would see this animation

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lMYRGsk ... e=youtu.be

And once you click on the menu, then you would see the settings show and from thereon it's your work. I think freeing the menu from the box, makes it lighter, simpler and elegant. Have a 24/7 square icon sitting on the upper left corner feels odd and enclosed. Obviously here, you can decide where to place the button and how to activate it.

anditosan wrote:
I wanted to contribute to this discussion by giving the menu a different treatment. Once you hover over the corner, you would see this animation

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lMYRGsk ... e=youtu.be

And once you click on the menu, then you would see the settings show and from thereon it's your work. I think freeing the menu from the box, makes it lighter, simpler and elegant. Have a 24/7 square icon sitting on the upper left corner feels odd and enclosed. Obviously here, you can decide where to place the button and how to activate it.

I'm not sure that hiding the menu completely is the way to go as it might confuse some users. How about we keep three little pips sticking out from the edge of the screen much like an unopened android menu, that then would jump out once hovered over?

anditosan wrote:

sreich wrote:i feel like it needs more blending of some kind so it doesn't look so out of place, the old one had a nice sort of blend to it. but perhaps that is just me, i'm not an artist/design person.

I wanted to contribute to this discussion by giving the menu a different treatment. Once you hover over the corner, you would see this animation

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lMYRGsk ... e=youtu.be

Hover over and more pointless, distracting, useless animations? No thanks. I'd rather have the cashew occupy half the screen if it would just be still and quiet without throwing effect fireworks on my face if I move mouse near it. People already complain about GNOME activities hotcorner and message tray in addition to everyone hating on those Windows 8 charms that appear when least wanted. Let's not take that failed route.

daedaluz wrote:Hover over and more pointless, distracting, useless animations? No thanks. I'd rather have the cashew occupy half the screen if it would just be still and quiet without throwing effect fireworks on my face if I move mouse near it. People already complain about GNOME activities hotcorner and message tray in addition to everyone hating on those Windows 8 charms that appear when least wanted. Let's not take that failed route.

May I remind you of our rules for giving feedback? You could have said that in a much nicer way...

Thinking about it carefully, the toolbox button doesn't properly follow the HIGs anyway; it looks more like a "chip" of panel than a button, which is potentially confusing to users. Also, arbitrarily gluing it to an edge is also a bit off, and it can't be resized either. There's a bunch of issues with it because it doesn't behave as expected: it doesn't look like a button, and it doesn't act anything like a plasmoid. Adding all these weird styles to differentiate it as "special" is breaking the guidelines were using in applications - maybe we need to treat it like it's nothing special.

Towards a solution, we have a UI guideline working its way into our apps where the design is usually a round clickable button. Methinks what we need to do is style the toolbox button like similar menus, and treat it like any other plasmoid by allowing users to move it away from edges/corners, with the option to be resized. It doesn't need to be removable (but I, personally, would like to have the option - even if the system sounds the klaxxon and requires 37 dialogs when you do).

If we allowed it to be configured, and alternate solution to allowing user to remove it might be allowing users to simply turn down its opacity to as low as 10-20%; still visible in case of "emergency" but not driving users insane with an omnipresent control either.

Proposed button designs;

colomar wrote:

andreas_k wrote:
Context menus should never be the only way to get to an important function (see also the HIG) because one cannot rely on users to find them.

What if the function to hide the Plasma toolbox is added to the context menu? Then, if the user hides the toolbox, that user must know of that context menu's existence.

CTown wrote:What if the function to hide the Plasma toolbox is added to the context menu? Then, if the user hides the toolbox, that user must know of that context menu's existence.

I would normally agree, but you'd be surprised what some users can accidentally do; my boss wiped out a chromebooks OS trying to download a picture from an SD card - never doubt the power of a user to destroy anything you give them access to; Colomar is right in that we need at least one reliable easy-to-detect access point which is failsafe.

It's a visual pet-peeve of mine; I don't notice it anymore, but my reptile brain screams at me on occasion because there's one odd little thing on the desktop I can't customise - I do think we can do a better job of making it more flexible.

daedaluz wrote:

anditosan wrote:

sreich wrote:i feel like it needs more blending of some kind so it doesn't look so out of place, the old one had a nice sort of blend to it. but perhaps that is just me, i'm not an artist/design person.

I wanted to contribute to this discussion by giving the menu a different treatment. Once you hover over the corner, you would see this animation

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lMYRGsk ... e=youtu.be

Hover over and more pointless, distracting, useless animations? No thanks. I'd rather have the cashew occupy half the screen if it would just be still and quiet without throwing effect fireworks on my face if I move mouse near it. People already complain about GNOME activities hotcorner and message tray in addition to everyone hating on those Windows 8 charms that appear when least wanted. Let's not take that failed route.

Well... that is more like saying, "I don't like animations, I don't like Gnome." If you have something more consistent and proven, I think it would add to this conversation.