KGet now

The workflow in Rekonq
With a right click on the webpage you get a list of all links which you can download. You can select the files you'd like to download. When you click on Download you get the save information with the transfer group. After this step you come to the KGet GUI. For each download you can get detailed informations. That's it.



The workflow in Firefox
For Firefox I connect KGet via the FlashGot addon. When you select some links you can download the selected links or you can download the list of all links. The difference between the Rekonq integration was that you don't see the first step where you have the selection of the files you'd like to download. You jump to the save to destination step. There you can remove the selection but you don't have a search and you don't can select additional files.

Integration
When you look at the research the most users use the app as a stand-alone. But if you use the stand-alone app you have to know the download url because the icon menu only show New Download and there you have to copy the download path and you only can download one file. Via the menu you can go to import links where you can download selected files from an url.


KGet future

File selection and download
My proposal is to merge the file selection and the download destination part.

1. Section is the URL
Also when the URL is selected via browser integration this would be visible. The File selection and download task is every time the same.

2. Documents
The list of linked documents from the above URL. If the user select save link as or save selected links the selection was preselected but you can also see all other files
The links are listed via a detail view but only the filename was shown in the standard settings. The file size would be really great, but I don't know if KGet get this information. If the user also want to know the location (server), description, ... the user can add this information via right click on the detail view header. In the original list the filename, description, filetype and location was shown, but with all this information you can't read the filename. So in the standard view the user will see the mimetype icon, filename with extension and size (if possible).

3. Filter
Via a search field the user can filter the document list. There was a nice tag technique representing on the kde planet. the search would also use the technique to search for different information separated via , and shown as separated text field. In addition on the bottom you have some standard filters (you can define them in the app settings).

4. Destination
The last destination was used when you don't select anything. In addition you can select via the mouse predefined destinations (defined in the app settings)

5. Tags
tag your downloaded files. In the app settings the user can also define automatic selected tags like a tag for the URL, ....

6. Rename
an integration for krename would be nice, kget support plugins, so this could be supported via plugin. In the app settings you can turn this plugin on/off also the tag menu could be a plugin which you can turn on/off.

KGet GUI
Simple by default. Maybe I forget some missing column from the survey then I'll update the mockup.


powerfull when needed. Sidebar for the download navigation and detail properties.


For the download history there is a sidebar (you can turn it on/off via the icon in the status bar) and for detail information there is a button in the status bar like you know it from ktorrent. In addition there is the overall download time and download speed (when the user want to reduce the download speed you can write there the maximum download speed).

Summary
Exclude the tag feature all other informations are also now available in KGet. KGet now use a detail list view. I prefer this view, because the user can add/remove columns instead of a 2 line view. To merge the select and the save folder query you reduce the clicks and I think the user have a better overview. When you look at the screenshots and the mockups they look a bit different, BUT the functionality is the same.

thanks for reading

Great work, Andreas! Some unsorted thoughts:
Really distracting to me today is the progress dialog. You only discuss KGet's main form but not the download progress form (perhaps it comes from somewhere else).

File selection:
It looks easy but doesn't it takes some time to read (filter) and fill in (tags, destination) the form until you can start the download actually?

Mockups:
The list view is okay for only a few items but clutters when you add more information. I miss the total size and would like to have the progress bar wider.
Detailed information are not advanced and "powerful". For instance, to switch the view mode to find out where a file comes from takes too much time. I would use a (rich) tooltip for additional information.
I guess the same function hides behind Download and Start, and the latter is just to restart downloads after pausing all actions. Why not merge the buttons and adjust the icon according current state (as you do below for every item probably).
What's about other functions, like cancel, delete or open/start? I'd say a menu button makes sense here. During the download its default is pause/restart, cancel is offered on dropdown and open shown but disabled. When finished open/start becomes the default and delete should be there too.
In this context, what's about prioritization?
Tags are on the same level as file type or date but completely user defined. I wonder how tags are added/deleted.
The status bar is not self-explanatory. At least captions are needed here.

Heiko Tietze wrote:Really distracting to me today is the progress dialog. You only discuss KGet's main form but not the download progress form (perhaps it comes from somewhere else).

what do you mean Heiko?

File select
You have right there is space for improvement. The "problem" is that you have 4 sections. I think the URL section is necassary that the user understand what he do. I would remove the tag section but tags are useful and when they should work, every app have to use them. But maybe you can hid it by default at the app settings. The focus on this window should be select your download files and where to save them. the other informations like tags show all download files from the webpage and filters should be in the background. Do you agree?

Mockups
- I like the list view because the user can add and remove rows, but you have right when you use two lines for each download like in the CTown mockup you can share more information. But how the user can show/hid informations?
- The size you can see is the total size of the download not the downloaded size. the header is missing. sorry.
- The tooltip is a nice idea how it works when the user want to copy something from the tooltip like the download url. in the property window you can see on the right the symbols for folder, ... I like the pallel on the bottom because you don't need the arraws for each item and I think it would also be easy to code.
- show detailed information is not powerful you have right. I only want to say that you can show advanced informations like priorization, ... in the detail view on the bottom.
- stard and pause could be one bottom. I fully agree
- tags, ... hm the problem of tags is that there is no "finished" system how they should work and so I would waiting until there is a solution and than push them into KGet and use the baloo backend.
- status bar needs some improvement. if the bottom detail view is not desired that you can hid the status bar. I like it for download apps because you can move there the main informations.

I move the mockup into https://share.kde.org/index.php/apps/fi ... ernet-kget

I'd like to separated KGet into 4 parts
1. Webbrowser intergration
2. Select download data and destination
3. KGet GUI
4. Status information

1. Webbrowser intergration
a. an Icon in the webbrowser for download the page documents and for status informations would be cool
b. On the webpage you can save on link
c. On the webpage you can save links from a selection
d. On the webpage you can save links from the page



2. Select download data and destination
e. First Mockup for 1.b. and 1.c.
f. Second Mockup for 1.a. (all) and 1.d
g. when you select one file (or some) you will get the window with only the selected files. If you only use the URL you get all documents linked on the page. But you can also select additonal files when you only select one file in the webbrowser.
h. For the tags you get a short list and when you want to add additional tag there is a more tags button.


3. KGet GUI
I'm not finished. I'll like to support Heikos recommandations.

4. Status information
Simple status notification integration as you know it from file copy.

3. KGet GUI
I don't like the look of the status bar. The speed and minutes don't fit to the tabs. But the two line list would work quite well as CTown and Heiko suggested.

I really like your proposal andreas! Great job.

While, I'm not sure how detailed we can get KGet's web browser integration, I do like what you proposed. That new download dialog is also a lot easier to use compared to what currently happens you one right clicks on any page in Firefox and clicks the "Flashgot All" option.

My favorite part is the Download Dialog. I just have a few questions so we can be on the same page here:
1) Does using the mimetype make it so every mp3 file goes a mp3 subfolder in the defualt downloads folder?
2) What happens if I make "wife" the default folder, is it a transfer group in the same way as current KGet transfer groups.
3) How do you use tags to set up the destination in your proposal?
The way I envisioned destination by tags is, if the user sets up a default destination for a tag, then that tag will become available for use as a transfer group. How do you guys feel about that idea?

I also like that you switch to a two item list. As a popular type of view, users should be used to it. Also, is the first three items selected in this list. If it is, then I love the way those items are selected without the use of blue. I couldn't think of a way around it so I'm glad you were able to. However, are you against the idea of using checkboxes (like the way I did)? I feel checkboxes help people who don't like/understand keyboard shortcuts A LOT. Also, it removes the need for a "Pause All" or "Start All", etc. because there is a checkbox to already select all items. I feel the "All" selecting checkbox can clear clutter from the toolbar. I also like how you split the content into subsections (with the date being the headers). The arrows you have for marking priority is a great idea. However, instead of a circular progress bar, I believe it could be replaced with its numeral representation in bold. Then, it should be moved on the other side of the priority buttons.

I saw in the mockup toolkit how there is a mockup where the details side bar is dark (that's where I got the idea from). I was hoping that would become some kind of tradition. Why, well, why do any traditions exist?

Also, right now KGet has a dialog called "Transfer Settings" that lists files. Each file has options for three items: mirrors, signatures, and the correct checksums for verifications. Right, now I'm using tabs on the details pane to get access to the files. Then, one a user clicks on a file and then clicks on the "Signature" button, a third tab appears that allows the viewing of already made signatures and has the ability to sign files (perhaps through some sort of KDE GPG/PGP integration) However, maybe the status bar could be used for this instead? I can make a mockup later (I have to leave in a bit). But the idea is that the statusbar would contain the same tabs I was using already. Statistics could be made part of "History" I guess (unless I am not understanding how you are using the term, "statistics").

All in all, I like your proposal a lot! It's well thought out.

CTown wrote:My favorite part is the Download Dialog. I just have a few questions so we can be on the same page here:
1) Does using the mimetype make it so every mp3 file goes a mp3 subfolder in the defualt downloads folder?
2) What happens if I make "wife" the default folder, is it a transfer group in the same way as current KGet transfer groups.
3) How do you use tags to set up the destination in your proposal?
The way I envisioned destination by tags is, if the user sets up a default destination for a tag, then that tag will become available for use as a transfer group. How do you guys feel about that idea?

At the destination section you have several predefined download folders buttons like download, tags, mimetype, video, wife, ... this buttons are the transfer groups. You can configure the behaviour of the transfer groups in the app settings. for example
mimetype
- images will move to \home\user\downloads\pictures
- movies will move to \home\user\downloads\movies
wife
- documents will save into \home\user\wife\downloads\*homepage*

The user can configure and use this transfer groups via the download dialogue.

CTown wrote:I also like that you switch to a two item list. As a popular type of view, users should be used to it. Also, is the first three items selected in this list. If it is, then I love the way those items are selected without the use of blue. I couldn't think of a way around it so I'm glad you were able to. However, are you against the idea of using checkboxes (like the way I did)? I feel checkboxes help people who don't like/understand keyboard shortcuts A LOT. Also, it removes the need for a "Pause All" or "Start All", etc. because there is a checkbox to already select all items. I feel the "All" selecting checkbox can clear clutter from the toolbar. I also like how you split the content into subsections (with the date being the headers). The arrows you have for marking priority is a great idea. However, instead of a circular progress bar, I believe it could be replaced with its numeral representation in bold. Then, it should be moved on the other side of the priority buttons.

I don't like the checkboxes. because
1. I have a "fast" internet connection so I don't have to use the prioritization
2. There is a drop down icon for pause them all, download them all, ...
3. I don't know where to move the checkboxes because you only need the checkboxes at the not finished downloaded files.
4. For what do you need the checkboxes. Prioritization will be done with the right arrow icons at each download document. Pause also and when you want to pause all download there is an icon in the icon bar.

The circular icon is not the progress bar, it should show the transfer speed (mb/s). with the bottom blue line you can see the download progress and with the circular icon if the download server have enough speed. is the bottom line dark grey, than the download is stopped at xx %.

The first three items are grey to show that this files are not finished downloaded. When you select an download document than the selection is blue (from the colour scheme).

Tags for the download destination. I don't know how they would work. I don't like the main tag because
1. you have an additional click and
2. you have to remember when you search for the file.
1. resolution download all files into one folder and group the folder for tags.
2. resolution make folders in the download folder with all tags and make hard-links
3. Use the tag section in Dolphin

CTown wrote:I saw in the mockup toolkit how there is a mockup where the details side bar is dark (that's where I got the idea from). I was hoping that would become some kind of tradition. Why, well, why do any traditions exist?

I know the dark colour look good, but it isn't the breeze colour scheme so in "real life" the app use the colour scheme. don't fix to colours and icons. The user can switch them (oxygen icons, breeze dark colour scheme, ...) but of course I like them to and the bottom property view look better in dark.

CTown wrote:Also, right now KGet has a dialog called "Transfer Settings" that lists files. Each file has options for three items: mirrors, signatures, and the correct checksums for verifications. Right, now I'm using tabs on the details pane to get access to the files. Then, one a user clicks on a file and then clicks on the "Signature" button, a third tab appears that allows the viewing of already made signatures and has the ability to sign files (perhaps through some sort of KDE GPG/PGP integration) However, maybe the status bar could be used for this instead? I can make a mockup later (I have to leave in a bit). But the idea is that the statusbar would contain the same tabs I was using already. Statistics could be made part of "History" I guess (unless I am not understanding how you are using the term, "statistics").

I like the tabs in the status bar because you have a fix place for additional informations like the properties, history (statistics), transfer settings, .... statistic would be a diagram of the download history, so history would be nicer. an additional tab for the transfer settings would work also well.

CTown wrote:All in all, I like your proposal a lot! It's well thought out.

Thanks. The best thing at this work is for me that someone make a proposal and with the feedback the ideas growing and the app design is getting better and better.

summary
- I know that the web browser integration could be tricky to develop. but I'm searching after a well designed workflow.
- I think that the transfer groups and download folders are the same. The transfer groups are maybe more powerful. How to define the transfer groups would be shown in the app settings. And therefore the design isn't finished yet.
- The wife download folder is very important for me because we share one desktop and she trash my download folder.
- should we use checkboxes?
- the circular speed barometer doesn't work as expected.
- the bottom tabs for additional information is a good think because you can add additional tabs for transfer settings, ...

Hello,

Awesome job. Really.

andreas_k wrote:The circular icon is not the progress bar, it should show the transfer speed (mb/s). with the bottom blue line you can see the download progress and with the circular icon if the download server have enough speed. is the bottom line dark grey, than the download is stopped at xx %.

It looks like a progress indicator. We could display the speed as a blue circle (the higher the speed, the greater the circle) inside the gray ring. Some suggestion of the meaning (eg a label showing the current speed) would be great, too.

Louis

andreas_k wrote:
The user can configure and use this transfer groups via the download dialogue.

Thanks, so essentially you are using the transfer groups KGet already has. I just wanted to make sure I fully understood your mockup.

andreas_k wrote: I don't like the checkboxes. because
1. I have a "fast" internet connection so I don't have to use the prioritization
2. There is a drop down icon for pause them all, download them all, ...
3. I don't know where to move the checkboxes because you only need the checkboxes at the not finished downloaded files.
4. For what do you need the checkboxes. Prioritization will be done with the right arrow icons at each download document. Pause also and when you want to pause all download there is an icon in the icon bar.

Yeah, perhaps checkboxes are unnecessary. I just figured some users would want to stop select downloads while keeping the others going. I guess "crtl+click" would still work but not all users use keyboard shortcuts. Though I guess that most users are not going to have enough downloads that canceling a few of those downloads one by one will cause them a headache. Once again, I really do like those prioritization buttons.

andreas_k wrote:
The circular icon is not the progress bar, it should show the transfer speed (mb/s). with the bottom blue line you can see the download progress and with the circular icon if the download server have enough speed. is the bottom line dark grey, than the download is stopped at xx %.

But what does a full blue circle mean? Does it represent the max bandwidth of the user? Will KGet do a speed test to know the max bandwidth? I'm not too sure if the transfer speed circle is necessary.

andreas_k wrote:The first three items are grey to show that this files are not finished downloaded. When you select an download document than the selection is blue (from the colour scheme).

Well, the grey is a good idea anyways.

andreas_k wrote:Tags for the download destination. I don't know how they would work. I don't like the main tag because
1. you have an additional click and
2. you have to remember when you search for the file.
1. resolution download all files into one folder and group the folder for tags.
2. resolution make folders in the download folder with all tags and make hard-links
3. Use the tag section in Dolphin

So, I guess transfer groups are here to stay then? Great, because I actually do like them; it's just they didn't do so well in Heiko's analysis.

andreas_k wrote:I know the dark colour look good, but it isn't the breeze colour scheme so in "real life" the app use the colour scheme. don't fix to colours and icons. The user can switch them (oxygen icons, breeze dark colour scheme, ...) but of course I like them to and the bottom property view look better in dark.

But isn't everything in the Mockup Toolkit styled in the Breeze theme?

andreas_k wrote:I like the tabs in the status bar because you have a fix place for additional informations like the properties, history (statistics), transfer settings, .... statistic would be a diagram of the download history, so history would be nicer. an additional tab for the transfer settings would work also well.

Thanks. The best thing at this work is for me that someone make a proposal and with the feedback the ideas growing and the app design is getting better and better.

I also like your idea of tabs in the statusbar. I actually reworked the way transfer settings mockups I made earlier to your status bar: https://www.dropbox.com/s/uehh4b1qpnghz ... r.png?dl=0

1. The status bar without any pane coming out at all. What I want to point out are the (1) button to make the last used pane appear, (2) the "Details" tab, and (3) the "Files tab".
2. The user gets to Point 2 by clicking on the "Details" button. It's just the same details pane as before but in Breeze light colors.
3. The user can click on the "Files" tab for a list of files KGet shows in the "Transfer Settings. A user can double click on a file to rename it or click on the arrow next to the file for it's transfer settings (which is a single pane with three collapsible headers).
4. The first header is the mirrors. As you can see KGet can already find two mirrors on the latest Neon5 iso. Here, the user can disable or add mirrors.
5.. Another header is the signature. If the file has a signature it will be shown here. Also, already made signatures (made throught Kontact or KGPG) can be shown here for easy signing. There is even an add button (most likely to start KGPG's new function).
6. The other header is verification. Any checksum can be added here. When, the file is finished, KGet can tell the user whether each file is verified or not.

I used the arrows on the file section so users cannot get lost. For instance, the user is always one arrow away from the list of files. Also, if the user gets lost, all the user has to do is either click on the button on the sidebar to collapse the bottom sidebar or click on the "Details" button to find more familiar information. Also, the only popup dialogue now would be the one to make a new signature.

Any thoughts or suggestions? Also, it's pretty late here. Good night!

CTown wrote:Yeah, perhaps checkboxes are unnecessary. I just figured some users would want to stop select downloads while keeping the others going. I guess "crtl+click" would still work but not all users use keyboard shortcuts. Though I guess that most users are not going to have enough downloads that canceling a few of those downloads one by one will cause them a headache. Once again, I really do like those prioritization buttons.

we can use the + symbol when you hover over the mimetype icon. Same selection functionalty than in Dolphin, ...

CTown wrote:But what does a full blue circle mean? Does it represent the max bandwidth of the user? Will KGet do a speed test to know the max bandwidth? I'm not too sure if the transfer speed circle is necessary.

Good point. I remove the circle and add an diagram in the icon bar.

CTown wrote:So, I guess transfer groups are here to stay then? Great, because I actually do like them; it's just they didn't do so well in Heiko's analysis.

I don't separate between download folder and transfer group, because it's the same you can choose an download folder or an download folder where you put the files in an user defined way.

CTown wrote:I also like your idea of tabs in the statusbar. I actually reworked the way transfer settings mockups I made earlier to your status bar: https://www.dropbox.com/s/uehh4b1qpnghz ... r.png?dl=0

I have the same suggestion, but maybe we can use for different things (details, transfer settings, ...) an separte tab like in the above mockup. so we don't need the arrow to navigate you can click on the tab. You need less clicks and nothing is hidden behind an arrow.

DWD
I make a draft for DWD integration. There is space for improvement, please comment.


KDE Connect
And when I think on DWD I think on KDE Connect intergration. This would be great
you sit on the couch and serf on the mobile and want to download something you copy the URL, go to KDE Connect KGet app add download and the file will be downloaded on your main computer. Now KGet have aso an web interface so when you ping the webinterface in the browser you can start the web interface right now. I don't tested them now.

andreas_k wrote:

Heiko Tietze wrote:Really distracting to me today is the progress dialog. You only discuss KGet's main form but not the download progress form (perhaps it comes from somewhere else).

what do you mean Heiko?

Picture or it didn't happen

(Perhaps I can switch this dialog somewhere off)

About the mocks I think you are doing great. The best we can do to support Lukas is when you, CTown, et al. push the advanced layout and I propagate the simple notification tool. And since nobody commented my nice interactive prototype I add some a screenshots.



Interactive mockup: http://vo5jbp.axshare.com/kget_simple.html

The idea is to have KGet for notification only with a global configuration. One could define an activity "video conference" where KGet's setting comprises of a limited bandwidth, for instance.

Is it not possible to use the same notification than the copy dialog. you copy something from the internet (server) to your disk. at the copy notification there is the status bar, the stop/play button. and also the copy speed. why there is something new needed.

The setting for the notification will be in the system settings (notifications). Where you can turn the notification on of, ...

I don't think that the monitor clipboard, download folder, ... should be in the global settins. because no other app than KGet support monitor clipboard and the download folder should be at the transfer settings of KGet.

the linked copy dialog was the old dialog when you don't use the "new" notification dialog. so if KGet support the notification you don't see this (kde3) dialog.

Hi, some mockups

3. KGet GUI

An update for the gui. I would say a clean up. the last mockup has to much informations.

1. I remove the sidebar, because KGet is a download manager not a file browser. When you want to see the taged files, audio file than use Dolphin. But there is a search where you can search for filenames, tags, date, ...
2. the DWD was updated (I use the mockups from Kven, kde.share is really nice )
3. when DWD is not available the information will be in the icon bar.
4. I separate between open and finished downloads. the open downloads are on top with an extended list view and the finished downloads is an icon view with preview grouped and sort after date.
5. open downloads have the required informations and an bigger stop icons (or start if the download is stopped)
6. I also make an mockup for the right click on the paused file there you see the new icon for reduce speed. this icon is also in the DWD. click on it and the speed is reduced to 15 % (you can change this in the app settings)

7. the tabs on bottom with the additional informations.

4. Status information
I make an screenshot how the notification would look like when KGet is integrated into the Notification centre.


Lukas say that we are on fire. Thanks. please feedback to get better and better.

The svg file is at share.kde.org

@Heiko
About that dialog: I think you have some incorrect settings somewhere. I only see that dialog for the root user (which is probably using more upstream defaults compared to my user account).

I do like your simple mode as I see a need for it. I also like you made a KCM for it. This way, KGet can be used without its main UI probably through KRunner and/or a Web Browser, right? However, I think it should include something more than just a default downloads folder. Perhaps at least creating mime type sub folders (Downloads/Audio) by default to differentiate it from not even having a download manager. Also, how will the user enter a checksum to verify the file (when the file is not obtained through metalinks). Though, I see your point. I can see regular downloads + easy verification enticing new users to KGet.

Also, if you are going to make a KCM for System Settings I think you can just disable the system tray icon by defualt and just use the KCM + Notification Center buttons (for play, puase, etc.). I'm not a fan of system tray icons; especially for a program where the user is purposely avoiding its main UI (as in this "simple UI" case).

@ andreas_k

We could reduce the number of clicks by having the transfer settings available at a glance: https://imgur.com/Rxk1zgi

I think that the table embedded in the detail pane is a bit overkill. I think properly spaced out text is enough to get the job done.

I also don't think a separate tab for torrents is a good idea. That would actually be a regression as KGet shows torrent downloads in the same way it shows http downloads.

1. I agree with you that the sidebar is going into Dolphin's territory.
2. I like the DWD stuff. I guess a few more buttons in the window decoration won't hurt anyone. Though, I would actually prefer to try DWD first.
3. When DWD is not in use, what do you think of adding more actions such as sorting: https://imgur.com/lIwMbbK? Or is sorting by priority enough?
4. Separating finished from downloading is a nice idea.
5. Users love icon views! But what about entries with multiple files (like through torrents or batch downloads)?
6. I like the context menu.

CTown wrote:This way, KGet can be used without its main UI probably through KRunner and/or a Web Browser, right?

Yes, and it gets closer to activities. But Andreas is right, a KCM makes more sense when it covers more or less all network activity, including wget for instance. I'm curious about Lukas opinion now .