improve usability in task manager
Page 1 of 1 (9 posts)
Tags:
task manager, system tray, launcher, plasma, tasks
task manager, system tray, launcher, plasma, tasks
Registered Member 
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On the panel for some aplication i have a shortcut icon, a task button and an
system tray icon.... why not merge all in one? I just tried the kde 4.6 task manager plamoid and found few problems like: - it's not possible to execute the same app twice with the new launchers; - the launchers icons are too small; I think few thinks could be changed in short soon: - launchers and task should work as ONE. not hiding the launcher to show the task button - the icon should have the same size as the tray icon... maybe removing some borders. - the new option to show the laucher should be removed the laucher should be keep by default like in recent app(recent and favorite apps in kicker are useless btw) most people use always the same apps so this will improve usability. - add an option to choose if the tasks should show the text label Few more thinks maybe can be changed later: - the launchers/tasks/icons could be more customizable almost like the plasmoids so icons could have more menus like in system tray and have some app specific information like what is playing on amarok etc. I know that some plasmoids do that and I can put them on the panel but they wont run when the app is executed and and will be more waste of space besided the app icon. This ways the System Tray will be less clutered too. Few examples: http://www.strixcode.com/j7goodies/ http://gizmodo.com/5131933/giz-explains ... os-xs-dock I've been using both MacOS X and Windows 7 and i think the MacOS X task manager is the best one. I think the KDE 4 task manager should be even better.  Don't tell to just use another task manager or to fork it... I guess some of these changes need to be done on libtaskmanager I'am a developer and i really wish i had some time to do this. Sorry for my bad english. thx |
KDE Developer
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I can't quite get what you mean with that?
yeah, you're right, when I look at the systray it's clear that it's a bug insinde the tasks-applet and not because of available icon-sizes. I'll have a look at this, asap.
So, you mean that everytime i close an app that has no launcher (and i never had a launcher) a launcher would be created automatically? Well, this is clearly not something for a default-configuration, as it can and will lead to confusion. But we're thinking more and more in this direction of automatization, so something similar as an optional feature maybe worth more thinking.
There has been a review-request for this some time ago, and it was refused due to a too complex config (completely against what kde is known and loved for, if you ask me). You have my support for this idea, but I don't think it will come very soon. (though this idea has come up again in a recent discussion on plasma-devel) At last my personal opinion about Docks: There are two types of applications: - The ones I use - The ones I have opened in the background and need to access quickly (e.g. kmail, amarok) When the system-tray and the taskbar get merged (=>dock) there is no differentiation between the two, and e.g. amarok is shown (almost) the same like rekonq. So when I have a look at my taskbar/dock I see ~8 items instead of ~4 (counting kmail, akregator, amarok, kopete), which looks defenitely more untidy... So my personal preference is to have my taskbar and systray clearly seperated, and so not to use a dock, but that's, as I said, just personal preference. |
Registered Member
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I completely fail to understand the idea of launchers in the task bar at all. I know that I am a stupid ignorant, so please enlighten me!
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Registered Member
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right now I have this: when I click on a launcher button a kind of a notification button is showed to let me know that the aplication is being executed and it's hidden again; then the launcher button is hidden and a task button is showed. my proposal is: when I click on a launcher button the button jumps or glows or sth like that (look at the "Fancy Tasks" options) to let me know that the aplication is being executed; then some information is added to the launcher to show that the aplication is being executed. no other button are showed. this is the way both MacOS X and Windows 7 works and i think it's the more important improvent. You don't have to look around to see if the aplication is being executed. An option to execute the application again should be added as well... i run the filemanager multiple times and i can't do that with this launchers.
Great. thx.
not quite. i mean the launcher/task should be created when the aplication is executed like it is right now(with extra imformation that the app is running) but it's not removed when the user closes the app. like if it was added to a recently used apps.
Thx for supporting this. I read somewhere about it and that it was refused. I use KDE since version 1 and one of the main think i like on it it's flexibility and may options it has. i didn't saw the code but i really don't understand how such a simple think can have a complex option. maybe the code wasn't good or sth. maybe the task manager should be rethinked from scratch to be more flexible.
In my opinion this don't need to be untidy... if the launcher/task/tray icon could be arranjed on the left and the new tasks added on the right. i think you still can acess them quicly. plus i guess you want to have notifications about new mails on kmail and what is playing on amarok and that could go on the laucher/task too. this way you will only have one icon fo each app.
Thx for you personal opinion. Apple does a LOT of usability testing that's why they do the interfaces the way they do and later(Years) people get the same conclusion their way is the best way... I just got that conclusion. They don't do things this way just because it's fancy or sth. I don't mean it's perfect or sth and I think and should be more flexible so people can use it whatever they like more. I don't think the system tray should be removed but some icons shouldn't be there. Few more post that i think are related to this and should be added to a brainstorm about the taskmanager: brainstorm.php#idea43570_page1 brainstorm.php#idea91258_page3 brainstorm.php#idea92998_page2
The point is that you avoid wasting space by not having the same app 2 or 3 times on the panel and you have only one place to manage your most used apps.
Last edited by xpete on Sat Feb 05, 2011 9:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Registered Member
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Ah, then I can see it make sense for some apps that you are likely to start, but only ever start once, since if the launcher stays it does not save space...
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Registered Member
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But you can remove it if you don't need it. |
Registered Member
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Then they wouldn't be launchers anymore, by definition. If you just want a list of applications to launch, use quicklaunch.
They are the same size as the icons in the task manager, and resize with the panel.
KDE developers have already said they are not going to do this.
So it automatically adds every application you use as a launcher? This would rapidly become unusable for people who use more than a handful of applications. If anything, this should be an option, but frankly I think it is terrible idea. Most applications I use a lot I never launch directly, they are only ever opened when I click on the proper file type in Dolphin. This was result in most of my launchers being ones I will never use.
KDE developers have already said they are not going to do this. This is also a duplicate of existing ideas and bug reports.
This is already planned. It is also a duplicate of existing ideas and bug reports. Please only post one idea per thread, and please check for duplicate ideas before posting. This is six independent ideas, only one of which is valid (the one about automatically adding launchers). The rest are either in-progress, duplicate, wontfix, or in most cases a combination of two or all three of these. Please create a new idea dealing solely with the automatic launcher bit.
Man is the lowest-cost, 150-pound, nonlinear, all-purpose computer system which can be mass-produced by unskilled labor.
-NASA in 1965 |
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Registered Member
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what? A launcher is supposed to execute and application... I already have shortcuts on my panel plus the taskmanager... But I think that's a waste of space to have a launcher and having another button to manage the same app... This is what the launchers on the taskmanager are supposed to fix but they don't as they are on version 4.6.
Anton said he was going to look at this. I just follow few forum post and planetkde and I don't have time to follow everything related to KDE. This is written anywhere else? Anton, can you give me feedback on this?
Ok. I knew probably many people won't agree with that I thought this was the MaCOS X behavior... just retested and it's not... maybe you are right... This was not important to me anyway and i'am droping this idea.
I know. But if more people want's it they should say it and that's what I'am doing. I hope this will help to change kde developers mind.
Where? I'am just adding information to the brainstorm and giving my support to this. that's why I added some link to my reply.
I seacher for similar ideas on the forum and I post few link about the few ones related that I found. I guess you didn't read my reply. You didn't even counted the problems I want to fix well and you didn't wrote about my main idea. What you say that is the one valid idea is the less important one. The main think I want with on my forum post is to make the taskmanager launchers useful and the main idea is: "When I click on a launcher button the button jumps or glows or sth like that (look at the "Fancy Tasks" options) to let me know that the aplication is being executed; Then some information is added to the launcher to show that the aplication is being executed. No other button are showed. this is the way both MacOS X and Windows 7 works and I think it's the more important improvent. You don't have to look around to see if the aplication is being executed. An option to execute the application again should be added as well... I run the filemanager multiple times and I can't do that with this launchers." Is this already being done? Everything else is related to this and maybe could be done at once. Maybe I should have called my post taskmanager revamp or sth like that. I'am just doing a brainstorm about the taskmanager to get some feedback etc... That's not what this is supposed to be? TheBlackCat, thx for your feedback. |
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Registered Member
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Then I am not sure what you are asking for. If you want the launcher to disappear when the application is launched, use a launcher. If not, use quicklaunch.
It was discussed and rejected in the plasma-devel mailing list last week.
This is not the proper place to do this. Very few developers read this forum. If you want to argue your case, use the plasma-devel mailing list. But don't expect to convince them, lots of people, including me, have tried and failed. It was discussed again just a few days ago and rejected again. So feel free to bring it up, but don't be surprised if developers just direct you to the previous discussions or tell you that they have heard all your arguments before. I personally would advise against bringing it up again in this case, it has been discussed so many times it is more likely to annoy them than convince them, but you can do it if you want.
If the idea is already present elsewhere in the brainstorm forum, making a duplicate will only make it harder to track users' opinions and any progress on implementing ideas. That is why we only allow one idea per thread, and one instance of each idea. The ultimate goal is to move popular ideas to bugs.kde.org if they aren't taken up by developers beforehand. This, however, is something that has been planned by plasma developers at least before 4.5 came out.
Yes, one of those is one of the duplicates I mentioned.
Whatever your main idea was, you have a lot of other, independent ideas in here as well. These have to have their own thread. But many of them are pre-existing ideas, and those would closed if you posted them.
These are two separate ideas. At least for me, it does show the application is executing. I get a little spinning thing in the task manager. I also get the bouncy icon in my mouse.
You don't have to in KDE, either.
This is yet another, independent idea. Further, if you want to use this, you should be using quicklaunch instead of a launcher. At least with the file manager, you can also add a "open new window" button to the toolbar, which would be even more convenient.
But they don't have to be done at once. For instance, developers could implement the "open new instance of this application" thing but not implement any of the graphical effects you suggested. So, say they implement one part but not the other. What should we mark your idea as? It would be impossible to keep track of the progress on ideas if they are more than one idea per thread. And what if someone likes your graphical ideas but doesn't like your "launch this application again" idea. Should they vote the idea up or down? If it is possible to implement one part of your idea without implementing another part, they have to go in separate threads. That is the only way we can properly keep track of them.
The point of the brainstorm forum is not just to post ideas, it is to pass those ideas along to developers and keep track of their progress. In order to do this, we need to have only one instance of every idea, and we need to have one idea per thread.
Man is the lowest-cost, 150-pound, nonlinear, all-purpose computer system which can be mass-produced by unskilled labor.
-NASA in 1965 |
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