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Flow and pen pressure handling

User avatar andreasresch
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Flow and pen pressure handling

Tue Apr 24, 2018 7:32 am
Hello.

I'm in the process to switch from Photoshop to Krita, but am still struggling with the brush handling and management. As I've gotten pretty used to my Photoshop brushes over the years, I want to recreate some of the most used ones as close as possible to keep my workflow consistent. This however is not possible for the ones that have a combination of pen pressure enabled for Opacity and Flow at the same time. There's too much detail visible with the stroke itself which makes the stroke too busy.

This is an issue that was discussed back in Sept. 2016 (https://forum.kde.org/viewtopic.php?f=288&t=136165) but still remains unsolved. So I'm bringing it up again to maybe convince the programmers that this might be worth adressing, It's especially important for people coming from Photoshop.

So here is a comparison for two of my standard Photoshop brushes. On top are the two Photoshop strokes, below are the strokes created in Paintstorm Studio (great program but too problematic and slow with masked brushes) and at the bottom are the two version done in Krita 4.0.1. The strokes have pen pressure on for Opacity and Flow, Rotation is controlled by the pen direction and spaing is at a very low value (0.01 for the first brush).

Image

Please look at the full resolution here to see the issue better ... http://www.andreasresch.at/upload/images/Brushtest_01.jpg

As you can see the versions of Photoshop and Painstorm Studio are practically identical. The Krita version looks quite different though. There's too much detail in the stroke itself. On top of that the fiirst brush is very sharp compared to the other two programs and spacing is visible although the spacing is set to as low as I could (0.01). This gives the brushes a completelya different style that is not what I was hoping for.

So maybe the programmers have a bit of mercy with us Photoshop users and give this issue a closer look.

Cheers,
Andreas
User avatar TheraHedwig
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Re: Flow and pen pressure handling

Tue Apr 24, 2018 9:48 am
The brush is sharp becausr you set the spacing so low.

As for the rest, that needs a copy of paintstorm or photoshop to test with. It might be that flow is applied differently in those, but if it is applied in the way I suspect it might be it could be a super complicated piece of code to get working, to the point it isn't a bugfix but would need to become a kickstarter stretchgoal.
User avatar andreasresch
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Re: Flow and pen pressure handling

Tue Apr 24, 2018 10:01 am
TheraHedwig wrote:The brush is sharp becausr you set the spacing so low.

As for the rest, that needs a copy of paintstorm or photoshop to test with. It might be that flow is applied differently in those, but if it is applied in the way I suspect it might be it could be a super complicated piece of code to get working, to the point it isn't a bugfix but would need to become a kickstarter stretchgoal.


There are downloadable demos of both Photoshop and Paintstorm Studio available. As for how this result is achieved, there's a diagramm in the post from 2016 (viewtopic.php?f=288&t=136165) who might have an idea about that. Looks like the Opacity level overrides the Flow level somehow. It seems as if Paint Tool Sai also handles the Flow like Photoshop does. So it seems as if Krita is the exception here. As for the complexity - that's for you to define. I'm not a coder. But if it takes a Kickstarter campaign and a stretch goal to resolve this, my hopes are a bit low that this will be fixed any time soon and for the sake of productivity I will have to stick with Photoshop for a while longer.

Cheers,
Andreas
User avatar TheraHedwig
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Re: Flow and pen pressure handling

Tue Apr 24, 2018 10:48 am
Whether other programs have the feature doesn't make it easier to implement, on top of which, we frankly only really care if people genuinely have use for it, so no need to add that kind of justification.
User avatar andreasresch
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Re: Flow and pen pressure handling

Tue Apr 24, 2018 11:20 am
TheraHedwig wrote:Whether other programs have the feature doesn't make it easier to implement, on top of which, we frankly only really care if people genuinely have use for it, so no need to add that kind of justification.


I never said that it makes it easier because other programs handle it similarly amongst each other. And there's nothing to justify - these are just observations.

I'm part of the "people" and I would genuinely have use for this. Otherwise I would no have spent time on doing the comparison and starting this thread. As this topic was already brought up over a year ago and there are similar reports about it on Reddit, I'm obviously not alone. But if that is too little to make you care, there's nothing I can do about it. As there are a lot of Photoshop users out there who might be interested in Krita, I think it is worth some effort to make the transition for them as fluid as possible, so they can transition without getting frustrated in the transition process too quickly and can keep up their workflow if so required.

Cheers,
Andreas
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Re: Flow and pen pressure handling

Tue Apr 24, 2018 11:41 am
Ah, sorry, that must have come across as terse, I just meant that if you use it that's all that is necessary.

It's really not about a lack of caring either, it might just be a super complicated bug, and that will take time and money.
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Re: Flow and pen pressure handling

Tue Apr 24, 2018 12:15 pm
TheraHedwig wrote:Ah, sorry, that must have come across as terse, I just meant that if you use it that's all that is necessary.

It's really not about a lack of caring either, it might just be a super complicated bug, and that will take time and money.


As I assume that the work on Krita will continue, there's a finite amount of time available. So it's more or less about the prioritization of tasks. For new users the whole brush customization topic might be less important and they might be fine with the default brush set that is coming with Krita. For more experienced users and professionals who are used to their tools in other programs this is a different story. And I think this is quite a big group to take into consideration. A valuable one as well as they might have a presence on the internet which will spread the word about Krita.

I'll leave it at that. My plans to switch to Krita in the near future are on hold for now, but I'll keep an eye on the development to see where it goes.

Cheers,
Andreas

 
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