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Making KDE Qt less

wlisik
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Making KDE Qt less

Thu May 18, 2017 1:07 pm
I have KDE installed and it uses Qt* widely.
My desire is to get rid of Qt related **** software as Im on Gentoo and I have to compile everything and Qt related **** takes ages even on fast Xeon.
How ?
ivanthekdefan
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Re: Making KDE Qt less

Fri May 19, 2017 7:28 pm
You can't.
If you hate Qt that much, use Enlightenment or Cinnamon instead.


Hi, I'm Ivan, a competent computer user (which means geek to most). I run KDE neon Developer when it works and KDE neon User when Developer doesn't work.
Hope I helped you with any problems you may have had :)
wlisik
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Re: Making KDE Qt less

Sat May 20, 2017 5:56 pm
ivanthekdefan wrote:You can't.
If you hate Qt that much, use Enlightenment or Cinnamon instead.

Why I cant make KDE Qt-less?
wolfi323
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Re: Making KDE Qt less

Sat May 20, 2017 9:26 pm
wlisik wrote:Why I cant make KDE Qt-less?

Because the KDE desktop and most KDE applications depend on Qt.

If you wanted to make them not use Qt, you'd have to reprogram them yourself.

So, as ivanthekdefan wrote already, if you hate Qt that much, use something else.
wlisik
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Re: Making KDE Qt less

Sun May 21, 2017 9:26 am
wolfi323 wrote:
wlisik wrote:Why I cant make KDE Qt-less?

Because the KDE desktop and most KDE applications depend on Qt.

If you wanted to make them not use Qt, you'd have to reprogram them yourself.

So, as ivanthekdefan wrote already, if you hate Qt that much, use something else.

The problem is - many (if not most) of DEs make use of Qt.
wolfi323
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Re: Making KDE Qt less

Mon May 22, 2017 12:20 pm
wlisik wrote:The problem is - many (if not most) of DEs make use of Qt.

Really?
The only other one I know of is LXQT.

GNOME, Cinnamon, MATE, Enlightenment, XFCE, LXDE, WindowManager, definitely do *not* use Qt, most of them are actually based on GTK.
wlisik
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Re: Making KDE Qt less

Mon May 22, 2017 2:36 pm
wolfi323 wrote:
wlisik wrote:The problem is - many (if not most) of DEs make use of Qt.

Really?
The only other one I know of is LXQT.

GNOME, Cinnamon, MATE, Enlightenment, XFCE, LXDE, WindowManager, definitely do *not* use Qt, most of them are actually based on GTK.

I didnt say are based on; I said make use of (in this or that way).
wolfi323
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Re: Making KDE Qt less

Mon May 22, 2017 2:59 pm
wlisik wrote:I didnt say are based on; I said make use of (in this or that way).

You are still wrong.
Those that I mentioned do not make use of Qt in *any* way.
wlisik
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Re: Making KDE Qt less

Mon May 22, 2017 6:08 pm
wolfi323 wrote:
wlisik wrote:I didnt say are based on; I said make use of (in this or that way).

You are still wrong.
Those that I mentioned do not make use of Qt in *any* way.

If so, why Qt is pulled as a dependency?
wolfi323
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Re: Making KDE Qt less

Tue May 23, 2017 12:02 pm
wlisik wrote:
wolfi323 wrote:
wlisik wrote:I didnt say are based on; I said make use of (in this or that way).

You are still wrong.
Those that I mentioned do not make use of Qt in *any* way.

If so, why Qt is pulled as a dependency?

As a dependency of what?

If you install Qt (or KDE) applications, you need Qt as well, even if you use some other desktop environment.

Btw, if your main concern is the building time, you probably should just consider switching to a *binary* distribution... ;)
wlisik
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Re: Making KDE Qt less

Tue May 23, 2017 6:17 pm
As dependency of (as an example) transmission
Gentoo:
Code: Select all
emerge -pv --dist transmission

Code: Select all
1. sys-apps/vram >= 2.9.0-rc2.fphp
2. vr-devel/qtvr-beta
3. qt-devel/qtwebkit
(...)
20. web-servers/dani-chick-fck

BTW: what VR has to do with Torrent client? One huge WTF.

Want more? Read below!
Qt compile time on Gentoo (Xeon 3,9 GHz, 64GB RAM, using all 16 cores to compile)
Code: Select all
genlop -Sti qt
Compiled pkg:: qt
Compilation time:: 32:19:01 #hh:mm:ss


Now, Every pkg listed above has qt* as dependency and pulls it. If I said NO on confirmation, it wouldnt install transmission. Thats true to almost any app with UI out there. Qt* is mandatory. Thats what makes me nervous.

Add: I just stepped at ArchOS.

Code: Select all
pacman -P-S qt
Qt dependency ::
  qt-webkit
(and 1990 other pkgs. To list them all use -vA switch)

So as you can see, Qt is pulled by default in many distros.

And no - I will not change to binary distro. Why? Because binary distros lacks freedom of choice. With source distro you can (freely) choose what you want to have. Qt tries to take this freedom away.
User avatar ivan
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Re: Making KDE Qt less

Tue May 23, 2017 7:52 pm
> Because binary distros lacks freedom of choice. With source distro you can (freely) choose what you want to have.

off topic: My binary distro has a choice to install transmission without a qt-based UI. Doesn't your source-based one have the same choice?

on topic: Something that should be quite obvious, but it seems it is not. If you use software written for Linux, you will have to use Linux. If you use software that is implemented in C++, you will need a C++ compiler to compile it. If you use programs implemented with GTK, you will have to have GTK. If you use software that use Qt, you will have to have Qt.

Most DEs use GTK, and are Qt-free by themselves. If you try to install an application (like transmission) which uses Qt, guess what, your package manager will install Qt. Regardless of the desktop environment you are using. The same goes the other way - I have a Qt-based DE, but if I want to have Gimp and Inkscape installed, I need to have GTK installed.

Now, if this topic does not turn to something more than bickering, it is quite close to being locked.


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airdrik
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Re: Making KDE Qt less

Tue May 23, 2017 9:27 pm
I'd also recommend turning to the Gentoo forums for help with figuring out why emerging/compiling QT takes so long (not that I've done so myself, but a day and a half does seem rather exceptional).


airdrik, proud to be a member of KDE forums since 2008-Dec.
User avatar ivan
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Re: Making KDE Qt less

Wed May 24, 2017 5:16 am
@airdrik

+1, though the main problems I'd say are webkit and blink (chrome for of webkit) engines - they take a lot of time to compile.


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wlisik
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Re: Making KDE Qt less

Wed May 24, 2017 6:28 pm
ivan wrote:@airdrik

+1, though the main problems I'd say are webkit and blink (chrome for of webkit) engines - they take a lot of time to compile.

webkit is build on top of qt. Thats why we have package named qt-webkit.

 
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