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I can't understand why, but it's true: there are less people than there should be.
Brainstorm should be more promoted.

Just for a reference: look at http://brainstorm.ubuntu.com/
in KDE brainstorm the most voted idea has 100 votes, while in Ubuntu brainstorm... just look at http://brainstorm.ubuntu.com/most_popular_ever/

Moreover the structure is:

>> Problem
description of problem

#Solution 1
description
#Solution 2
description
.
.
.
#Solution n
description

That is a very good idea, because most ideas comes from a problem; moreover the structure permits also idea not related to problems or bugs.



this image is auto-explicative and you can compare to our, on KDE brainstorm (which just shows the difference between up and down votes and not the total of votes, that is and index on how the subject is important for the community)...


We just need to make better all the KDE world.

And sorry for my poor English (If you want, correct me )

After the next update more information will be shown. (up/down/neutral/sum)

I think something like "most-popular ideas" would be great because also some very good ideas with a lot of votes aren't on the first page anymore and there's not enough feedback. So there aren't any new votes anymore.

Like or not there is still a much bigger problem: this IS brainstorm. Any impressive idea, with millions of votes will remain as a simple idea if no one "can"/"wants to"/"knows how" implement it. That is, many votes, many discussion, but in the end the idea keeps being useless for the people.

Any chance to have a system to "implement an idea once it gets X votes"? Of course not, so you can promote this as much as you want, but it won't change this facts.

That's it, life works this way :-P

Regards

Mamonetti wrote:Any impressive idea, with millions of votes will remain as a simple idea if no one "can"/"wants to"/"knows how" implement it.

Absolutely. You overlook one thing though. There *are* developers that know how to implement most of these things. The question is what do their efforts go into? Brainstorm can be a tool (if they check in on it) to have their efforts more effectively align developer effort with user needs.

The only thing that is really needed is:

1. For users to express and discuss ideas in a constructive, reasonable sized, solution focused manner and...
2. For dev's to take users desires expressed here into consideration in their app.

I know some Devs such as Peter Penz (of Dolphin fame) and Giles Caullier (Digikam) take great interest in their users needs. This means the only thing left waiting is everyone here to help with .1.

Kubuntiac wrote:

Mamonetti wrote:Any impressive idea, with millions of votes will remain as a simple idea if no one "can"/"wants to"/"knows how" implement it.

Absolutely. You overlook one thing though. There *are* developers that know how to implement most of these things. The question is what do their efforts go into? Brainstorm can be a tool (if they check in on it) to have their efforts more effectively align developer effort with user needs.

The only thing that is really needed is:

1. For users to express and discuss ideas in a constructive, reasonable sized, solution focused manner and...
2. For dev's to take users desires expressed here into consideration in their app.

I know some Devs such as Peter Penz (of Dolphin fame) and Giles Caullier (Digikam) take great interest in their users needs. This means the only thing left waiting is everyone here to help with .1.

I absolutely agree: I tried to write same things, but my English isn't so good...

Some ideas need important modifications in KDELibs, sometimes also in KDECore. Such ideas can't be implemented without longer constructive discussion. (also with developers) When I look at some (of my) ideas, there is no such discussion.

But of course many ideas just need few modifications. Maybe you could rethink the mentoring-idea.

You are not alone
http://forum.kde.org/improve-producivity-t-60242.html

Going deeper
http://forum.kde.org/what-we-do-with-pcs-t-61161.html

The main issue, is how to implement this in a best and most simple way.
Might be even to reuse ubuntu brainstorm engine?

Lukas wrote:Might be even to reuse ubuntu brainstorm engine?

It's probably the best solution.

I have to add some important information about future of Brainstorm, of course I'm only one of mods and thus don't know the whole "truth".
But still... There was a lot of talk about KDE brainstorm using IdeaTorrent interface, but decision was made that for now this will do. And both KDE Brainstorm and IdeaTorrent are going through some changes. I was (and still, though inactive) a member of Ubuntu Brainstorm and I was a member before the interface change. So I know how it was before and after. I agree that the decision to have multiple solution per problem / idea can be useful, but it does give the idea a more cluttered feel.
Anyway in next implementation of our KDE brainstorm you'll be able to vote +1, 0 and -1. And sayakb also mentioned this on IRC:

once we wrap up with all the todo stuff, I'll try to make an interface that would atleast show rationale + voting pad on the forum view page, so that the user can read and vote, without having to open the idea

But as you can see this will be only implemented in none-determined future.
And one big reason not to use IdeaTorrent is that that would demand a new site something like brainstorming.kde.org which does in a bit different way already exsists - it's bugs.kde.org where you can make an wishlist "bug". But the interface of bko is "unintelligible" and does demands that you come with already well structured wish / idea. So KDE brainstorm is here to be some kind of middle man, to give you place to freely discuss ideas with other users and to send ideas to bko, which is the highest instance.
The only problem I personally see is the duplication of votes, as bko uses them as well do determine severity of wish. So the votes that were cast on lover sphere - KDE Brainstorm - get lost in a process. I still believe that votes should be somehow transferred with wishlist idea to bko as whole.
But this part, I must say that, is still a bit undetermined.
The difference between votes on Ubuntu Brainstorm and KDE Brainstorm is not only the time difference UB is there for more than a year KDE Brainstorm for half of it, but also that UB is distro specific, which in turn means that more users will use it, as not every users of KDE knows about this forum or wishes to use it - prefers the distro forum. It's upon you the users of KDE and distro forums to promote this forum and especially Brainstorm section, as it's a very special "tool" and way of communication between users and DE (which they in-fact use more that distro) and should really be used by as many users as possible.

The best solution would be a solution from scratch But this would need a lot or man power to make it properly.

So why not to make united Linux brainstorm board. Putting problems in a first place then leading by solutions.

Imagine if we could bring together KDE, ubuntu, SUSE, mint, arch and/or any other developing teems/ independent people in one place

Lets say a user asks how to go from B to F (the problem)
Then community generates many ideas/solutions how to do it. Each idea could be 'approved' by different teems and/or implemented KDE wide or as mods:
* Go from B to A, than to z
* Go B - C - F [KDE flag]
* Go B - D - F [SUSE flag]
* Fly from B to F directly [Arch flag]
* .....

KDE itself cant satisfy all and any user needs, and here distros came: they make things in a way, they user likes most.
Lets say ubuntu likes to have one job - one app, SUSE is a power station. And in most cases they would see things from different angles - different solutions.

In this way more ideas would be genearted AND solved, also each side would benefit

Furthermore, Brainstorm could be later exported as tutorials when gets done - many ideas is clear enough for that.
This would generate more views - more feedback to developers, more possible solutions.
Also this could be a tool for new users before deciding, whitch distro to use - just check on most valuable topics to you and pick the one.

This could be even merged with gnome and if there is no solutions for KDE, might be a gnome has a feature for this. A big filter non KDE solutions would be nice

What do you think?

Firstly, KDE brainstorm was never intended to be something like what the Ubuntu qa-poll (aka Ubuntu Brainstorm) does. It was intended to create a bridge between users and devs and to narrow down bko wishlists to good ideas so that it eases the task of the developers to choose from them.

As of Ubuntu qa-poll what I see is a huge bulk of largely unmanageable ideas, which often create a bottleneck situation for the ubuntu brainstorm team. The volume of ideas is in no way bad, no - infact, it is quite nice to have such amazing response. But it demands a large group of volunteers at the same time who devote their time to manage the website. Also, the IdeaTorrent project is pretty good, also on code level, but it would need:
1. A dedicated staff
2. An independent domain

It has been discussed several times on KDE MLs that we cannot choose to have an independent interface because lack of manpower who can maintain it. So using a dedicated software will be an overkill, at this point.

We are trying to implement almost all good ideas that have been posted for KDE brainstorm section, so that it can be made better. As we have a *lot* of other stuff lined up for release in near future, we cannot start working on an independent Brainstorm interface at the same time. But this dedicated interface is already on my ToDo, all I can do it finish up other things we have, so that we get time to work on this.

@Lukas
very good idea... how can we propose that?

This could be even merged with gnome and if there is no solutions for KDE, might be a gnome has a feature for this. A big filter non KDE solutions would be nice

@Lukas

If you are suggesting to have a non-KDE filter here at the KDE Community Forums, then it is unfortunately a WontFix. We will not have a non-KDE area in the forums, sorry.

Lukas wrote:So why not to make united Linux brainstorm board. Putting problems in a first place then leading by solutions.

Already proposed it :


But just that my idea would use IdeaTorrent.
But I agree with sayakb (who also opposed to my idea that Ubuntu Brainstorm, be used as "Linux Brainstorm ), this shouldn't be done on KDE forum. It should be a new site, which brings many problems to the concept, as some distros (well just Ubuntu) have their BRainstorming site, others have wishlist...
Anyway the change is coming to KDE brainstorm, but it won't become all-Linux-idea-board. It has even less sense than Ubuntu Brainstorm becoming that...

We could use IdeaTorrent here, but that will totally need its own registration (drupal 5.x/6.x), a new staff group, and totally different ACLs. It cannot be made to share the forum's accounts.. Why? Well, because the KDE Forum uses a MySQL db, like many other forums, while unfortunately, IdeaTorrent (stable) isnt out for MySQL yet (it works on pgsql-8.3). I think Nicolas is planning to port UB to MySQL, but not soon, afaics.

And if an independent site is done running on pgsql, I think it wouldnt be related to the forum then. But well, I think the kde-www MLs are worth a read, since it might reflect why an independent site wasn't set up.